How do you guys stand it ?

[Piscator]

My boss lives out in Ohio, he wanted to renovate a 1/2 bath on his first floor. He hired someone to do the work but he did the demo himself. When he pulled the sheet rock off he couldn't believe what was done by the previous owner. 2 electrical sockets buried inside the wall connect by an extension cord. Scary to think what kind of work is buried behind the walls of a house.

[ed morini]

Actually as far being sure of what your getting at the time of sale the p&s should require all the permits be in hand, that way when illegal work is uncovered the responsibility or liability lies with the previous owner and could help you with the building inspector when they are uncovered. Occupancy is the statement by the BI that the house conformed to all the requirements both state and local at the time. Occupancy at least in residential is seldom revoked, compliance is always foremost, therefore asking for the permits, checking for work beyond if any is the best bet.

I guess (but I don't agree) some feel that's it their house, they pay taxes and will do what they want, when they want, and how they want. The problem is that someday they sell the house to you. Compliance begins with at the individual level and I know that it can be a real pain getting all the paper work done prior to working. In our court case prone society do you really want to risk it.

Ed

[Raven]

How does that apply to a dwelling/property that is being sold as is...

maybe as is doesn't require an In place occupancy permit to acknowlege that the property needs an upgrade(s)...?

Yet some people want to move into a fixer -upper and remodel while they live there for convenience into a single room (probably illegal)

I'm sure all the local bylaws prevail but would welcome your comments
in that situation

[Raven]

Originally Posted by Piscator

. Scary to think what kind of work is buried behind the walls of a house.

i was surprised to find a wall full of oak leaves all lying flat (placed)
and also old farmer cover alls that were rolled up and stuffed in there.
(but no insulation)

newspaper dated 1919 were also found.....
work halted reading about all the cheap stuff for sale....lol , in the classified section

[ed morini]

I think buying a house "as is" is asking for trouble. The cases I am personally familiar with did not go well for the new owner...long story short...cost way more than the "deal" they got. Here in Ma and other states there is no statute of limitations on wrong or illegal work, even if you have permission from the BI. Anyone can ask to see and get copies of the permits issued (public record) and if there is any discrepancy between the permits and the actual conditions a red flag should go up. As the new owner without permits you will be on the hook. In addition, in the event of an insurance loss, the homeowners policy will be terminated because of non permitted work and the homeowner is out the monies he could have collected. As probably the largest purchase someone makes I think prudence should prevail.
As for the illegal work and later discovered, the BI will use the code in effect at the time of violation or the building date of the home if he is inclined to do so (break here for the new owner) and have the violation fixed to that code. It is usually handled this way because the newer codes have changed some much that their adherence could cause undue hardship fore the contractor or homeowner.

[ed morini]

The other problem here that I see from some of the complaints above is the feeling that all the regulations and procedures take to much time.
I have been building since 1968 and am 64 now and have seem a tremendous change in the whole permitting process. Used to be the BI knew you and that was that, especially if you were a "townie". Most of those guys were carpenters themselves and knew what was up. You never used a structural engineer, worried about load paths, because there were implied standards (and written codes back to 1908 if I remember correctly) . Everyone new who was good and who was not, and people listened to experience and used what others had learned.

Today new ball game, BI is a career path (not a criticism) and the code is the rule not the exception. Most of all the old guys are gone and along with went the old way of building. The process we have today establishes a paper trail to protect all that are involved.

Just for chuckles look up the Code of Hammurabi
The Secrets of the Code. | Architecture for Humanity

sorry for the length

Ed

[ed morini]

Sorry for not fully answering your question (senior moment). The occupancy for a dwelling will remain intack at the time of sale unless the town has a policy of property inspection (other than the FD) at the time of sale. Most BI's stay out of the sale end of a property unless they see something requiring immediate attention. In the cases I have handled, usually there was no problem with someone moving in provided they didn't gut the place. Some level of habitability has to be preserved. To be honest with you, with the way present codes are structured, you would be much better do a remodel room by room. I say this because today's code ICC Existing Building Code will prevail and the amount of work that has to be performed for compliance depends on one of the three levels of reconstruction perfromed, if you hit level 3 (guttting entire structure)compliance with the IRC, Intn'l Mechanical, plumbing, elect and Enery Code (strecth code may apply here) will be required. Doing a kitchen will not cause a level three but you may have some plumbing and electrical issues. If any of the exposed framing is insufficient it will have to addressed, any new work will have to comply with 2009 IRC prescriptively or a structural engineer can desig what you need. I f you have other specific questions give me a buzz pm me for #

[Raven]

is why i asked

that have around 10 to 80 acres
usually an old barn (desired)
and some sort of garage
or work area....

some are Vintage 1850 houses...
been there done that... not again!

some allot newer than that...
but sometimes the atmosphere is way
to compelling and you start thinking about it.

I like projects but not servitude to a lost cause.