Food stamps

[ecduzitgood]

Why don't they set the amount of money you get based upon weight? For example if your at the ideal weight for you height you get 100% of the amount given. If your 10 pounds over weight your given 10% less, 50 pounds over weight 50% less and so on.

[Nebe]

So the government would have the right to only control the weight of the poor? How about the working poor? The lower class, the middle class and the rich?? Doesn't seem fair to me. I would like to see welfare recipients face mandatory drug tests though and that is the same argument.
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[RIROCKHOUND]

Originally Posted by Nebe

. I would like to see welfare recipients face mandatory drug tests though and that is the same argument.
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In theory, I agree as well, except in Florida, it seems to be costing more to do the testing than the fraud/users they are catching....

[ecduzitgood]

Aren't food stamps to ensure a person has food? I don't feel a person who is obviously well fed or over fed should be getting as much. We need to find way to cut entitlements and this could be one potential cut. Wouldn't it be better for the person to be at a healthy weight to also reduce the cost to the healthcare system.
When it comes to the government controlling what people eat is say no. But if you go to the government for the handout/food stamps then I feel the government should have some control. If you gave your child an allowance and they just spent it all on candy and started putting on a lot of weight would you not step in and control how they spend the allowance?
You want complete freedom get out and earn it, you want help from the government then you are beholden to the government.
A human can go 3 weeks without food before death occurs.

[the point]

Originally Posted by ecduzitgood

Aren't food stamps to ensure a person has food? I don't feel a person who is obviously well fed or over fed should be getting as much. We need to find way to cut entitlements and this could be one potential cut. Wouldn't it be better for the person to be at a healthy weight to also reduce the cost to the healthcare system.
When it comes to the government controlling what people eat is say no. But if you go to the government for the handout/food stamps then I feel the government should have some control. If you gave your child an allowance and they just spent it all on candy and started putting on a lot of weight would you not step in and control how they spend the allowance?
You want complete freedom get out and earn it, you want help from the government then you are beholden to the government.
A human can go 3 weeks without food before death occurs.

Medical conditions could be the cause of weight Gain, Like my cousin She is a Big Girl and eats nothing due to her thyroid problem..

On another note it kills me to go to the store to spend 60 dollars get #^&#^&#^&#^&,,Then the lady in front of me in her pajamas who just rolls out of bed at 3 to pick her kids up from school(free daycare for her) with an over flowing carriage of food just swipes her food stamp card and on her way she goes with her steaks and lobster... Me Im getting frozen pizza and lunch meat....GRRRRR

[The Dad Fisherman]

What they should do is Categorize what the funds are drawn from on the card.

i.e....if you have $100 on the card, $30 can be used to purchase Meat, $25 for fruits and vegetables, $25 for Dairy, $20 for Grains. Once you spend your allotment on meat, you can't purchase any more. It would make people eat a more balance meal and stop rolling through with that same $100 on just Lobsters and Steaks

I know this is simplistic but you get my point,

[ecduzitgood]

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

What they should do is Categorize what the funds are drawn from on the card.

i.e....if you have $100 on the card, $30 can be used to purchase Meat, $25 for fruits and vegetables, $25 for Dairy, $20 for Grains. Once you spend your allotment on meat, you can't purchase any more. It would make people eat a more balance meal and stop rolling through with that same $100 on just Lobsters and Steaks

I know this is simplistic but you get my point,

That would be a start in the right direction.
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[fishbones]

One of the big problems with the program is people buying items and then selling them for cash to buy smokes, lottery and booze.

[RIJIMMY]

We've lost a very simple concept I was taught when I was 4 years old - Beggars cant be choosers

If you are getting $$ from the government, the government should be able to define exactly what you can spend it on. I recently read an interesting article - if you went back 100 yrs in time and showed people pictures of today's poor, they would be astonished. For thousands of years, poor meant unfed, overworked and skinny. today, poor means fat and out of shape. How can that be? I believe this thread along with school lunch menus are a major contributor.

[ecduzitgood]

I remember hearing about a store in Brockton (Rice's maybe) that got busted for buying EBT cards from people for halve the amount on the card. I'll ask my soon to be ex-friend who weighs 350 plus how much he gets to supplement his under the table income. I hope he doesn't spit his Heineken out when I respond to his saying to me "I don't know why I put up with you". Atleast he won't have to hide his cocaine use from me anymore after tonight...I'm loaded for bear
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PS. I won't be smoking his weed anymore either, I quit.

[Jackbass]

Ok carry on boys ^^^^^ lol
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[Bronko]

This is a huge scam statewide. They busted this individual to send a message, but clearly don't have the resources to go after every store doing this. But hey, free money is free money right? Spread it around.

Just another government sponsored handout of our taxpayer money gone awry.

Store Owner, 21 Others Charged in EBT Fraud Invest

[detbuch]

Debating what restrictions or requirements should be attached to the use of food stamps is anti-American. Not only does it further implant in us the idea that government can tell us how to spend our money, it's just another acceptance and affirmation that the Federal Government has dictatory powers that it was not intended to have. If we are going to go that far, perhaps the government can deny the right to vote to those who accept food stamps as well as dictating what foods and in what quantities the stamps will purchase. That would solve the problem of a huge portion of the population having a say in how the others who provide the money are taxed. The whole concept is not only anti-American, there is no provision in the Constitution which gives the Federal Government the authority to provide food stamps.

I know . . . I know . . . the SCOTUS has interpreted . . . etc. But the Constitution is specific, not vague. There is no specific or general power listed in it for the Federal Gvt. to issue food stamps to certain persons. Madison said:

". . . the government of the United States is a definite government, confined to specified objects. It is not like the State governments, whose powers are more general. Charity is no part of the legislative duty of government [meaning the Federal Gvt.]"

The charitable aspect of government was clearly to be left to the States and to the people, not to the Federal Government. Madison, Jefferson, (and even Hamilton who many say believed in very broad powers of the central government), all stated that the General Welfare Clause referred specifically to those powers enumerated in the Constitution.

OK . . . OK . . . so it's too late . . . the damage has been done. Well . . . this is exactly the kind of crap that has been heaped on American society in this and many other ways because that document has been "interpreted" to allow it. And if the direction taken continues . . . well . . . the whole concept of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness will be "interpreted" in a far different, government-dependent way.

[RIJIMMY]

so you dont believe there should be quialifications for federal small business loans, federal student loans, federal science grants?
how does that differ from food stamps? you have to meet certain qualifications in order to be part of the program.

if you are arguing the Fed should not be in any of this business, I understand but do not wholeheardtly agree.

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

so you dont believe there should be quialifications for federal small business loans, federal student loans, federal science grants?
how does that differ from food stamps? you have to meet certain qualifications in order to be part of the program.

if you are arguing the Fed should not be in any of this business, I understand but do not wholeheardtly agree.

Yup, I am arguing that the Fed should not be in this business of providing food stamps, and in most other redistributive, winner and loser schemes. Loans to individuals should be left to private, free-market entities. If the citizens of the various States wish to create State loans that is their prerogative. It is not, or should not be, the prerogative of the Federal Gvt. to impose the responsibility of such loans to individuals on all of us. Nor should it even be the prerogative of the Federal Gvt. to pick and choose to which or which type of individuals it will grant loans. Deciding which citizens will "benefit" the nation more than others is not only contrary to equality before the law, it is not the Federal Gvts. business. Why should science or students be considered more equal than the average citizen? And don't such grants and loans actually raise the cost of research and education? You're in finance. Doesn't market distribution of wealth and determination of price create a more realistic and inexpensive product than when government determines the distribution? The massive and ever-growing National debt should be a warning sign that the Federal Government has over-reached its Constitutional function and is in danger of creating an uncontrollable welfare state that will harm us as citizens and individuals far more than help us.

[RIJIMMY]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Yup, I am arguing that the Fed should not be in this business of providing food stamps, and in most other redistributive, winner and loser schemes. Loans to individuals should be left to private, free-market entities. If the citizens of the various States wish to create State loans that is their prerogative. It is not, or should not be, the prerogative of the Federal Gvt. to impose the responsibility of such loans to individuals on all of us. Nor should it even be the prerogative of the Federal Gvt. to pick and choose to which or which type of individuals it will grant loans. Deciding which citizens will "benefit" the nation more than others is not only contrary to equality before the law, it is not the Federal Gvts. business. Why shoiuld science or students be considered more equal than the average citizen? And don't such grants and loans actually raise the cost of research and education? You're in finance. Doesn't market distribution of wealth and determination of price create a more realistic and inexpensive product than when government determines the distribution? The massive and ever-growing National debt should be a warning sign that the Federal Government has over-reached its Constitutional function and is in danger of creating an uncontrollable welfare state that will harm us as citizens and individuals far more than help us.

makes sense

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by fishbones

One of the big problems with the program is people buying items and then selling them for cash to buy smokes, lottery and booze.

Bingo. In many cases, giving these people stuff that can be sold, is begging for trouble, and is a waste of public money. Like the NYC cop who used his own money to buy boots for the homeless guy...nice gesture, but it didn't work, as the guy was barefoot again the next day.

If you qualify for need, there should be soup kitchens where you can go for a healthy meal. I dodn't mind giving these people food to consume on the spot. I don't like giving them things that can be sold for crack or God knows what else. The current system doesn't address the problem of poverty. The root cause of povetry for many people (not all) is not a lack of money (that's a symptom), but rather, some behavioral issue (mental health, drug addict, lazy, learning disabled, etc).

I worked at a grocery store in high school. When food stamps came out, I'd see the same exact people, every single month, trying to buy cigarettes, loottery tickets, lipstick, perfume, etc...It made me sick to know that's where my money was going.

[JohnnyD]

Two things...

Originally Posted by the point

Medical conditions could be the cause of weight Gain, Like my cousin She is a Big Girl and eats nothing due to her thyroid problem..

A friend is a Nurse Practitioner that specializes in endocrinology. I asked her how frequent fat people are fat due to "genetics" (ie. a thyroid problem. She said very few fat people that would come to her office excusing their obesity to overweight actually had thyroid issues - she saw up to 20 people per day. Even still, if they did have thyroid problems, it would explain no more than 20-40lbs of extra weight.

As such, I don't buy the "it's genetic" excuse when people that are pushing 300lbs claim it's "not my fault". Thyroid issues didn't all of a sudden increase in the last 20 years, but laziness and a lack of personal accountability sure has.

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

I worked at a grocery store in high school. When food stamps came out, I'd see the same exact people, every single month, trying to buy cigarettes, loottery tickets, lipstick, perfume, etc...It made me sick to know that's where my money was going.

A story of my own from a couple years ago that still boils my blood. I'm in the self-checkout line at Stop & Shop. Waited a couple minutes for the person in front of my because they had a fair amount and just as they were finishing up a woman comes up to me "can I go in front of you, I'm only getting some gum?" I only had a few items but said it was no problem.

Then, she grabs some random gum from the rack, scans it and pays with her EBT card, but here's the kicker.....

She got $60 or so *CASH BACK*!!! Then, I saw her proceed to the customer service counter and buy a carton of cigarettes. These are the type of people we are providing "aide" to.

[justplugit]

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

As such, I don't buy the "it's genetic" excuse when people that are pushing 300lbs claim it's "not my fault". Thyroid issues didn't all of a sudden increase in the last 20 years, but laziness and a lack of personal accountability sure has.

Yes, I would venture to say if you look back at pics from the 30s.40s and 50s
you won't see any obese people. The word obese was not even in the dictionary then.
Thyroid problems exist, but with treatment, diet and exercise it won't add
250 lbs to a person's frame.

Like a friend of mine says, he never saw a fat person come out of a concentration camp.

[Piscator]

Originally Posted by justplugit

Like a friend of mine says, he never saw a fat person come out of a concentration camp.

Or boot camp.


We as a family eat very healthy. It costs so much more to eat healthy than not. The price of Fruits and Vegetables are insane. I guess what I'm trying to say is that it significantly costs more to eat healthy (unless you have a garden ).

[PaulS]

Originally Posted by Piscator

Or boot camp.


We as a family eat very healthy. It costs so much more to eat healthy than not. The price of Fruits and Vegetables are insane. I guess what I'm trying to say is that it significantly costs more to eat healthy (unless you have a garden ).

That is exactly why you see fat, poor people. Look how much food you get per dollar when you buy a bag of Fritos versus when you buy fruit. High frutose corn syrup (and escalators)!

[Piscator]

Originally Posted by PaulS

That is exactly why you see fat, poor people. Look how much food you get per dollar when you buy a bag of Fritos versus when you buy fruit. High frutose corn syrup (and escalators)!

You see plenty of fat rich people too. Going out for a run or walk is free. It's also easy to do when you don't work.............

Bottom line is exercise, if you exercise, you will not be fat. You don't need to belong to a Gym to exercise.

[PaulS]

Fat rich people are eating the poor people.

I'm always shocked at the beginning of the year when my gym gets packed with new, heavy people. I always think to myself that they should just get out and walk for a few months until they start to get into shape instead of wasting their $ on a gym that they won't use after a month and even if they do stay at the gym, they won't get the full benefits b/c they're still out of shape.

It drives me crazy when I see a car waiting for the spot closest to the mall until the driver gets his packages in the car b/c they don't want to walk a few extra yards. I'll drive by and when I get to that parking spot the driver is still waiting for the spot to open up.

[The Dad Fisherman]

The funniest thing is when you see people parking their cars illegally AT the Gym so they don't have to walk from the back of the parking lot

[Clogston29]

Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman

The funniest thing is when you see people parking their cars illegally AT the Gym so they don't have to walk from the back of the parking lot

then they walk of a tread mill for 30 minutes and wonder why they never make any progress.

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by PaulS

That is exactly why you see fat, poor people. Look how much food you get per dollar when you buy a bag of Fritos versus when you buy fruit. High frutose corn syrup (and escalators)!

We eat pretty darn well in my house. We also shop around sales and the seasons, make our own breads (about $1/loaf), make our own pasta (well under $1/lb), make our own tomato sauces, shop at farmers markets, focus our protein intake on beans/legumes, crock pot chili that has leftovers for a couple days and buy in bulk whenever possible. We average $50-70/week in food costs for two.

Does it take some time and planning? Sure does, but once we switched to mostly scratch cooking, we saved a ton of money on the food bill and we eat significantly better.

You know what else helps curb food costs.... Portion Control. Exercising portion control means that a dinner for four, actually feeds a family of four.

Like I said, it takes effort and planning. As politically incorrect as it is to say, the obese get obese because they typically live a sedentary lifestyle while eating garbage all day long with no considering to what they put in their body or how much.

[spence]

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

As politically incorrect as it is to say, the obese get obese because they typically live a sedentary lifestyle while eating garbage all day long with no considering to what they put in their body or how much.

It's politically incorrect because you really don't know why that person is obese to begin with. Yes, some are just lazy, but many others have health issues, depression or just funky DNA.

-spence

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by spence

It's politically incorrect because you really don't know why that person is obese to begin with. Yes, some are just lazy, but many others have health issues, depression or just funky DNA.

-spence

You must have missed (or decided to ignore) my previous post. Let's see what my talks with an endocrinologist resulted in:

"A friend is a Nurse Practitioner that specializes in endocrinology. I asked her how frequent fat people are fat due to "genetics" (ie. a thyroid problem. She said very few fat people that would come to her office excusing their obesity to overweight[that should have said "excusing their obesity to hormones"] actually had thyroid issues - she saw up to 20 people per day. Even still, if they did have thyroid problems, it would explain no more than 20-40lbs of extra weight.

As such, I don't buy the "it's genetic" excuse when people that are pushing 300lbs claim it's "not my fault". Thyroid issues didn't all of a sudden increase in the last 20 years, but laziness and a lack of personal accountability sure has."

Yes, some are just lazy, but many others have health issues, depression or just funky DNA.

Put another way for those that are 80+lbs overweight, "refuse to accept personal accountability." I sympathize for the *small minority* of people that do have a genetic issue, while at the same time, let's not set the rules for the majority based on a select few.

[justplugit]

If it's funky DNA, where did it come from when everybody was skinny
50 years ago? Ninety nine % of it comes from not taking personal responsibility for yourself.
Way to easy to blame DNA.

One of the first signs of depression is weight loss, while there is some weight
gain on some of the anti-depressants it can be managed with a proper diet.

Is it easy to exercise and eat the right food, no, but evertbody wants an instant
fix, some new diet craze or pill. People look for instant gratification, what they
need to avoid is instant potatoes.