Media Coverage Of Politics

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by PaulS

I didn't claim that they would go down but Johnny claimed that they went up b/c of Obamacare but still hasn't provided 1 bit of evidence.

You didn't say costs would go down, but you did absolutely say they wouldn't go up much. And across the country, people's healthcare costs are rising by much more than the rate of inflation. You said companies aren't ramping up premiums because of Obamacare. What's your proof of that? Did you conduct a survey of all the largest companies, talk to the Employee Benefits department, and find out how much of the % increases are due to Obamacare? Or are you speculating, and making assumptions that are favorable to the man you support?

Obama said healthcare costs would come down. That's what he said. That's not what is happening. Tell me where I'm wrong, please.

[PaulS]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

You didn't say costs would go down, but you did absolutely say they wouldn't go up much. And I've given you actuarial est. of the increases - none of them would justify a $2,500 increase in Johnny's premium. And across the country, people's healthcare costs are rising by much more than the rate of inflation. And they have for many, many years You said companies aren't ramping up premiums because of Obamacare. What's your proof of that? The minimum loss ratio law. Companies have to now give return premium if the claims don't hit a minimum loss ratio. Did you conduct a survey of all the largest companies, talk to the Employee Benefits department, and find out how much of the % increases are due to Obamacare? No, but has Johhny or you provided 1 piece of evidence to back his claim that costs went up $2,500 b/c of Obamacare? Or are you speculating, and making assumptions that are favorable to the man you support?I've posted what has been implemented so far and the est. claim cost increase of each. So that isn't speculation.

Obama said healthcare costs would come down. That's what he said. That's not what is happening. Tell me where I'm wrong, please.

So what discussion do you want to have? Johnny's $2,500 cost estimate or Obamacare? B/C your're mixing the 2.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by PaulS

So what discussion do you want to have? Johnny's $2,500 cost estimate or Obamacare? B/C your're mixing the 2.

I'm not mixing anything. I never claimed that Johnny's policy increased directly because of Obamacare.

I can buy that the loss costs for a 25 year-old are a small fraction of the loss costs for our whole population. But you can't look at it that way, because the healthcare loss costs are disproportionately driven by seniors who aren't paying their fair share. So any added cost is absorbed by those who are already subsidizing senior citizens and those on Medicaid. So if the impact is 1.5% of the total, those that actually pay into the system, have to pay much more than 1.5%.

And I don't believe that covering pre-existing conditions only costs pennies. If that were the case, companies would already be doing that.

Paul, why are many businesses avoiding the costs of Obamacare by cutting hours and cutting employees? If the effect of Obamacare were as negligible as you claim, why are so many businesses seeking, and getting, exemptions?

I'm sorry Paul. Obama has his talents. But even he is subject to this fundamental law of economics: you can't get somethin' for nothin'.

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Paul, why are many businesses avoiding the costs of Obamacare by cutting hours and cutting employees? If the effect of Obamacare were as negligible as you claim, why are so many businesses seeking, and getting, exemptions?

Weren't the effects of Obamacare supposed to be an average decrease in premiums?

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

Weren't the effects of Obamacare supposed to be an average decrease in premiums?

God damn right. Obama was going to force companies to offer unlimited lifetime benefits, force companies to cover pre-existing conditions, force companies to cover children to age 26, force companies to provide birth control. All that, and he said costs would come down.

If he could pull that off, I would be his biggest fan. But not only could he not pull it off, no one calls him on it.