Why isn't the simulas having an effect?

[striperman36]

He speaks and the world markets will take a dive.
Investors are not convinced that anything we do will fix the market.
Lassiez faire won't make it happen. We are going to see nationalization, iMHO.

[buckman]

Sure has been quite from the left on this site. How much time do we give the boy genius before he completely destroys the economy.

Last Sale 6794.99 Previous Close 7062.93
Change -267.94 Open 7056.48
Change % -3.79% 1-Week Range 7441.02 - 7033.62
Previous Close 7062.93 1-Month Range 8405.87 - 7033.62
Today's Range 6792.29 - 7058.95 52 Week Range 7033.62 - 13136.70
Last Trade Time 3:17 PM EST YTD Change -6469.81

Maybe next time we propose a budget we don't contradict everything we proposed to do in the Stimulas bill.

[striperman36]

Negative Vibes, gotta stop it with the negative Vibes.

[spence]

Originally Posted by striperman36

Negative Vibes, gotta stop it with the negative Vibes.

He can't, it's all he has...

-spence

[Bronko]

Dow 6,763.29 -299.64 -4.24%

Lowest in 12 years.

[justplugit]

Trying to push all his changes into the first 6 weeks of his Presidency has not helped.

"Act in haste, repent at leisure."

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by Bronko

Dow 6,763.29 -299.64 -4.24%

Lowest in 12 years.

Yes, and all of it has been directly caused by a man that has been in office for 5 weeks or...

While the Dow has a large effect on people due to their investments, it is too emotionally driven at a time like this and I do not value it as representational of anything except how "people feel the economy is today."

With the use of down-to-the-second trades, the Dow has become more of a vehicle for Corporate Finance companies to create wealth when considering day-to-day changes.

The Fed decides not to cut interest rates, the market drops 200 points. The next day, the market "recovers" 250 points - read: the market is undervalued and people buy.

I sincerely feel bad for those that are close to, or in retirement and have a ton of money in the market. They are the ones most effected by this because they do not have the time to wait for recovery. However, in a merely selfish manner, I hope the market keeps tanking - because I'm young and the market falling does not financially affect me. The more it tanks, the more bang I'll get for the money I've been socking away into CDs for the last two years in anticipation of just this happening. When the Dow was over 11,000, my accountant thought I was crazy for not opening an IRA - I thought she was crazy for even making the suggestion. Everyone involved with the Market has been Livin' La Vida Loca - now people are feeling the "next morning hangover."

I think the market is extremely undervalued right now. Professional investors are bewildered as to what the short-term outlook is for the economy and as such, are Shorting stocks like mad. The average investor doesn't have a clue what's going on aside from what the news tells him/her.

I'm holding on to the lapbar and waiting for the ride to end. When it does, I hope I enter the market at about the point when it reaches bottom.

[buckman]

Originally Posted by spence

He can't, it's all he has...

-spence

Give me something positive to latch on to. I'm begging ya

[striperman36]

Originally Posted by buckman

Give me something positive to latch on to. I'm begging ya

We're waiting for the GOP response of which there has been NONE!!!! NONE!!!

You have to give the floor to Limbaugh!!!

[Travis]

Originally Posted by buckman

Give me something positive to latch on to. I'm begging ya

I was very excited to see all of the new proposed taxes that are being brought to the table...more more more government...wonder how long before we start hearing revolutionary propaganda.

[Slipknot]

Originally Posted by buckman

Last Sale 7365.67 Previous Close 7465.95
Change -100.28 Open 7461.49
Change % -1.34% 1-Week Range 7850.41 - 7249.47
Previous Close 7465.95 1-Month Range 8405.87 - 7249.47
Today's Range 7249.47 - 7469.29 52 Week Range 7249.47 - 13136.70
Last Trade Time 02.20.09 5:40 PM EST YTD Change -5899.13

I wish it would. Any ideas? Alot of very educated guys on here. Help me out. IMO it's because it's a scam. You?

I don't know, it depends on what you mean by educated.

I have enough common sense I think to take a guess and say that I doubt this stimulus package if it has gotten into gear yet will have done anything immediate to the stock market.
What are you looking for miracles?
Maybe have some patience and give the guy a chance.

I personally don't agree with all this bailout crap, I say let them stand on their own 2 feet like I've had to do all my life, if they need to file for reorganization bankruptcy, then so be it. Putting the country way into further debt seems like a huge mistake to me.

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by Slipknot

I personally don't agree with all this bailout crap, I say let them stand on their own 2 feet like I've had to do all my life, if they need to file for reorganization bankruptcy, then so be it. Putting the country way into further debt seems like a huge mistake to me.

Agreed. Especially since AIG couldn't recover after the first few billion dollars they got and now they're being given more. The government has to pick their battles. Not everyone struggling should get a handout, only those with potential to recover.

My opinion is even more critical for the automotive industry. They are struggling because they have a business plan that has positioned themselves in a way that showed no outlook over the long term. Automotive companies have taken no initiative to create more fuel efficient vehicles and only do just enough to pass government-mandated standards. They have an archaic business plan and as such, positioned themselves for failure. They've also allowed the unions to rake them through the coals. It's no surprise to me that the one automotive manufacturer doing better than the rest has taken into consideration future markets and is also non-union.

[striperman36]

The autos may have no plan but why can't I buy this 53 mpg Volvo in America? They won't even sell it here, because we don't like diesels? Crazy
http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2008/09/1...%99t-have-one/

[striperman36]

http://blog.wired.com/cars/2009/02/volvos-low-carb.html

• C30: 60.3 mph and 104 g/km.
• S40 and V50: 58.8 mpg and 107 g/km.
• V70 and S80: 48.8 mpg and 129 g/km
• XC60 and XC70: 39.2 mpg and 159 g/km.

I looked all over for a small diesel, did get a 2.8L Jeep, about .5L more than I really wanted.

[JohnnyD]

Originally Posted by striperman36

The autos may have no plan but why can't I buy this 53 mpg Volvo in America? They won't even sell it here, because we don't like diesels? Crazy
http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2008/09/1...%99t-have-one/

It's because of a stigma put in place 20-30 years about about dirty diesel being horribly polluting - remember when the soot exhausted from Mach trucks was a big hot topic? Also, people don't realize even though they pay about 20% more for diesel, they get about that and more in fuel economy when compared to an equivalent unleaded.

[buckman]

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

It's because of a stigma put in place 20-30 years about about dirty diesel being horribly polluting - remember when the soot exhausted from Mach trucks was a big hot topic? Also, people don't realize even though they pay about 20% more for diesel, they get about that and more in fuel economy when compared to an equivalent unleaded.

Not to mention that a diesel can last several hundred thousand miles more. Thus justifing the added initial cost. I have yet to hear a reasonable explanation as to why diesel fuel is more then gas. Prior to 2003 it was cheaper.

[justplugit]

Originally Posted by Slipknot

I don't know, it depends on what you mean by educated.

Putting the country way into further debt seems like a huge mistake to me.

It just doesn't make sense. Let's get the economy back on it's feet first before we start passing bills that will put us into further debt and cause inflation down the road.
To follow the same path of spending what we didn't have in the first place, for whatever reasons, got us into this mess, how is it going to get us out?

We need stimulus based on concrete needs that can be started now.
Like infrastucter repair based on what really needs fixing, and there's alot of that.
Mass transit building with high speed mono rails.

People are afraid and we need something people can see to rally around to get back confidence now, not just things that are just ideas and are 10-15 years down the road before they come to fruition.

Ya, Green is good but till we get there we need oil and nuclear. These would create jobs within a few months. We will always need it as you can't run a military or even charge electric cars, all on wind or batteries.

Most of all we need something to rally the whole country around, FDR had WW2, not that that was good, Kennedy had space exploration, Regan brought back a feeling of patriotism.

Not that we shouldn't have different opinions, but "united we stand, divided we fall."

[buckman]

I believe the policies, stimulas bill, and the proposed budget are the cause for the Dow losing 3000 points, that's right 3000, since he took office. I also believe the actions of the House and Senate have sent a clear message to America. A message of Goverment help or fail. That's not the message Ameican's like.

[spence]

Originally Posted by buckman

I believe the policies, stimulas bill, and the proposed budget are the cause for the Dow losing 3000 points, that's right 3000, since he took office. I also believe the actions of the House and Senate have sent a clear message to America. A message of Goverment help or fail. That's not the message Ameican's like.

Have you been drinking, are you an idiot or do you just not care about the facts?

The Dow has lost 1186 points since Obama took office. All things considered a terrible slide, but not as you would have us regard it.

Additionally, the makings for this slide were put into action years ago, the result of many complicated policies that will take years to sort out.

Wall Street isn't interested in your assumptions of policy interpretation , they're interested in making money, and the fundamentals are still bad. Until the policy, or a recovery independent of government action takes hold, the conditions for a lasting recovery won't be in place.

-spence

[buckman]

Originally Posted by spence

Until the policy, or a recovery independent of government action takes hold, the conditions for a lasting recovery won't be in place.

-spence

Houston, we have a problem.

Spence, you should be in politics, every one of your post is about disagreeing, name calling and taking no position. Why don't you just tell us why you voted for Obama, and what policies he has put in place that you feel will benifit the country. I have been right about nearly every prediction on what would take place if a single party was given full control . You have been wrong on those same points. Want to try a couple more. End of two term limit for the President, Reparations

I care about the facts, I just made a mistake. .Kinda like Pelosi saying we lose 500 million jobs a month. You know, Spence, remember defending that.Your a forgiving guy

[RIROCKHOUND]

http://www.google.com/finance?chdnp=...JX:.DJI&ntsp=0

Just to back you up Spence....
I have a feeling many theses will be written at Bryant, Bentley, Babson, Harvard Business etc.. in coming years on the boom and bust of the last few years...


Interesting read on the rest of the world's opinion of our ability to turn it around...
http://money.cnn.com/2009/03/02/mark...ion=2009030215

[PaulS]

It hilarious (and somewhat sad) to hear the mindless drones trying to blame a Pres. who has been in office 7 weeks for the collapse of the economy b/c "he's the Pres." while refusing to use the same logic and defending Pres. Bush for 9/11.

[Fishpart]

You get more gasoline from a barrel than diesel fuel, hence a lower price. When you include refining capacity for gasoline compared to #2 Fuel in the US it all makes sense. When you are making heating oil it takes away from the diesel capacity.

We will recover when Mainstream Media says we can. Chances are it will be close to midterm elections and it will be marketed as a result of the actions of those currently in office

[RIJIMMY]

Originally Posted by PaulS

It hilarious (and somewhat sad) to hear the mindless drones trying to blame a Pres. who has been in office 7 weeks for the collapse of the economy b/c "he's the Pres." while refusing to use the same logic and defending Pres. Bush for 9/11.

If you took just a teeny second to bother to read the threads instead of your constant mantra of calling others who disagree with you "drones"you'd see that NO ONE said the collapse of the economy was Obamas fault, the point was that the stock market reacts NEGATIVELY to Obamas announcements of his plans. One could assume that the people whose sole purpose is to benefit from a market rise, would delight in action by the government ot "improve" things, no? I put up proof to counter those that say the market is reacting to the fundamentals. Bernanke made one lame announcement that the recession may be over by year end and the same day the market was up over 200 points as a result. The MArket reacts, so far it reacts negatively to Obama. Not a good sign.

[PaulS]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

If you took just a teeny second to bother to read the threads instead of your constant mantra of calling others who disagree with you "drones"you'd see that NO ONE said the collapse of the economy was Obamas fault, the point was that the stock market reacts NEGATIVELY to Obamas announcements of his plans. One could assume that the people whose sole purpose is to benefit from a market rise, would delight in action by the government ot "improve" things, no? I put up proof to counter those that say the market is reacting to the fundamentals. Bernanke made one lame announcement that the recession may be over by year end and the same day the market was up over 200 points as a result. The MArket reacts, so far it reacts negatively to Obama. Not a good sign.

Theres more mindless droning on in this forum about how Obamas solely responsible for the decline in the markets than I have seen anywhere else. The theory that with whole world in a deep recession, one man words are responsible for moving the market each day is laughable. You have the world's largest insurer needing to borrow more $bill b/c their demise would wreck havoc on the insur. industry, the world's biggest corp. with a stock price at decades low and the world's largest car companies all loosing their shirts, yet is only Obama's fault is laughable. Maybe he should tell us to not worry and if we want to do something for out country, we should continue shopping.

[RIJIMMY]

Originally Posted by PaulS

Theres more mindless droning on in this forum about how Obamas solely responsible for the decline in the markets than I have seen anywhere else. The theory that with whole world in a deep recession, one man words are responsible for moving the market each day is laughable. You have the world's largest insurer needing to borrow more $bill b/c their demise would wreck havoc on the insur. industry, the world's biggest corp. with a stock price at decades low and the world's largest car companies all loosing their shirts, yet is only Obama's fault is laughable. Maybe he should tell us to not worry and if we want to do something for out country, we should continue shopping.

a LOT of brillaint people are agreeing with the mindless droning. I dont expect you will believe us, after all we have a law professor and junior senator leading the worlds economy. So above, I included the news article that the marked moved UP over 200 points when Bernanke spoke, yet you thinks it laughable that the presidents plans DONT move the market? WHo is mindless?

BTW, Paul, how do you like all the earmarks in the new budget? I guess its just another promise broken in the last month.

[buckman]

Originally Posted by RIJIMMY

a LOT of brillaint people are agreeing with the mindless droning. I dont expect you will believe us, after all we have a law professor and junior senator leading the worlds economy. BTW, Paul, how do you like all the earmarks in the new budget? I guess its just another promise broken in the last month.

All the ear marks are Bush's fault. That's their story, I'm not kidding

[RIROCKHOUND]

Well, it just shows the market is silly

[buckman]

Thanks John, good info.

[striperman36]

low-sulfur distillate
road tax

delivery, I can't believe that.

and marketing, gas cars don't last as long

it's an endless list, but go to any other country and it's 95 pct diesel
compared to 10 pct gas but freight is 90 pct diesel