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Old 02-21-2009, 04:50 PM   #1
buckman
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Why isn't the simulas having an effect?

Last Sale 7365.67 Previous Close 7465.95
Change -100.28 Open 7461.49
Change % -1.34% 1-Week Range 7850.41 - 7249.47
Previous Close 7465.95 1-Month Range 8405.87 - 7249.47
Today's Range 7249.47 - 7469.29 52 Week Range 7249.47 - 13136.70
Last Trade Time 02.20.09 5:40 PM EST YTD Change -5899.13

I wish it would. Any ideas? Alot of very educated guys on here. Help me out. IMO it's because it's a scam. You?
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Old 02-21-2009, 05:25 PM   #2
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How fast to you expect things to change?
The financial marketplace is still a mess, Geithner may nationalize some of the banking system. Gold is over 1000 per oz
Pelisoi is still in Itally, Kerry is in Israel, Schwarzenegger can't get a balanced budget CA may declare bankruptcy , GM - Chrsyler have no plan, and Plugfest is over and you didn't go.

The market doesn't believe we have a solution
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:10 PM   #3
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Ok, now you're just being stupid.

-spence
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Old 02-21-2009, 07:25 PM   #4
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YEAH talk to me at DJI 6000 in 2 weeks.

No confidence is reflected in the marketplace
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Old 02-21-2009, 07:48 PM   #5
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The problem is, we still have major national banks which are insolvent.

This is not Obama's fault.

I do think we should be very careful nationalizing any banks (i.e. let's not) and it's looking like the Obama Administration agrees.

This is a good thing.

-spence
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Old 02-21-2009, 07:58 PM   #6
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Isn't majority ownership as much a nationalization?
Although this little tidbit from WSJ

The White House tried to knock down speculation that the government is preparing to nationalize several large U.S. banks, but some bankers complained that the Obama administration needs to act even more aggressively to shore up confidence in battered financial institutions.
Robert Gibbs, a White House spokesman, said Friday afternoon that the month-old Obama administration "continues to strongly believe that a privately held banking system is the correct way to go."
The comments reversed a broader decline by U.S. stocks that at one point pushed the Dow Jones Industrial Average close to 1997 levels. Still, the Dow finished down 100.28 points, or 1.3%, to 7365.67, a new low for the current bear market. Friday's decline left the Dow with its worst weekly drop in four months.

However, the market is still having doubts.

The government has obviously decided to let us stew for another weekend. All we really know is that we either are or are not going to be beneficiaries of knowing some details of the bank "restructuring" plan within a few days. In the meantime, the market will have to continue feeding on uncertainty.

And you weren't at PlugFest either
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Old 02-22-2009, 07:41 AM   #7
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I'm not saying who's fault it is.(in this thread anyway)
I would think that when a trillion dollar bill is passed, it would have some sort of effect on how investors feel companies will benifit.This magnitude of money flowing into the economy should help. I think it has had a negative effect.

IMO the problem stems from the anticipation of a bill that would benifit the country and passing one that screws the country. I think investors realize that the bill that was passed, will do long term damage to the U.S. economy.
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Old 02-22-2009, 08:01 AM   #8
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Ok, now you're just being stupid.

-spence
Educated guys?
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Old 02-22-2009, 09:22 AM   #9
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My take on DJ. It's gambleing plain and simple. You give a guy your bucks to grow a business, he gives himself a hefty check and bonus because he thinks the money is his. And since the money is "his" now he will try to keep it all. Except for a piddly portion that he pays back to to his suckers to keep them quiet. Until the whole thing comes unwound, then he gets the Government to tax the suckers to pay back the money he "lost".

He that would make his own liberty secure, must guard even his enemy from oppression; for if he violates this duty, he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself.
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Old 02-22-2009, 09:28 AM   #10
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I\
IMO the problem stems from the anticipation of a bill that would benifit the country and passing one that screws the country. I think investors realize that the bill that was passed, will do long term damage to the U.S. economy.
I just believe people believe it will have no effect. I don't think most people think past tomorrow right now. Many of the working are just several paychecks or the lack there of from insolvency.
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Old 02-22-2009, 10:01 AM   #11
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I just believe people believe it will have no effect. I don't think most people think past tomorrow right now. Many of the working are just several paychecks or the lack there of from insolvency.
Your right, I just feel the promise of a trillion dollars should have given it a bump at least. If this had been a true stimulas bill instead of a blueprint for bigger govornment, maybe it would have had a positive effect. The retired people ( and my 401k) needed something that would have worked.
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Old 02-22-2009, 10:03 AM   #12
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My take on DJ. It's gambleing plain and simple. You give a guy your bucks to grow a business, he gives himself a hefty check and bonus because he thinks the money is his. And since the money is "his" now he will try to keep it all. Except for a piddly portion that he pays back to to his suckers to keep them quiet. Until the whole thing comes unwound, then he gets the Government to tax the suckers to pay back the money he "lost".
It's also where most people have there hopes for retirement deposited.
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Old 02-22-2009, 12:04 PM   #13
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Your right, I just feel the promise of a trillion dollars should have given it a bump at least.
Please stop saying "the promise of a trillion dollars" and trying to making it even more extreme than it is.
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Old 02-22-2009, 12:43 PM   #14
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Please stop saying "the promise of a trillion dollars" and trying to making it even more extreme than it is.
Nah, he's having a lot more fun trying to trip it up hoping it's a big failure. I'd be willing to wager he's accused Liberals of doing the exact same thing regarding the war in Iraq.

There hasn't been a rapid response in the markets because there are too many varibles that haven't been isolated. At the time Obama signed the bill into law the big story was about banks and the unknown as to what might happen.

Most economists believe that the recession isn't going to lift until best case end of this year and it could go deep into 2010. If that's the case I think it's a bit unreasonable to expect the Market to sound the all clear simply because Obama used a pen.

Geeze...

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Old 02-22-2009, 01:07 PM   #15
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Your right. In fact the combined cost of the bailouts are well over a trillion dollars

And no, I pray it works. For the sake of future generations. Unfortunatly I'm a realist and I deal in substance.
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Old 02-22-2009, 03:30 PM   #16
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It's also where most people have there hopes for retirement deposited.
my point exactly. These shysters have crushed dreams, ruined lives and educations, and have lived pretty high on the hog from the blood and sweat of their victims. Now that is all in shards, they want their victims to foot the bill and sadly they have to or the whole shebang goes up in flames. I had a 401k eviserated in the 80s, I salvaged what was left and invested else where, where I had and have a modicum of control. This last "adventure' would have ruined me otherwise. And may still yet.

He that would make his own liberty secure, must guard even his enemy from oppression; for if he violates this duty, he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself.
Thomas Paine
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Old 02-22-2009, 03:34 PM   #17
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Back to the question, the market hasn't responded because of fear and distrust. When the guys who run the investments start to behave responsibly and hell even legally, the investers will return. You can't fool all of the people all of the time. I pray it works, too, buckman. The people don't deserve this and right now they're scared, angry and mistrustful.

He that would make his own liberty secure, must guard even his enemy from oppression; for if he violates this duty, he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself.
Thomas Paine
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Old 02-22-2009, 03:50 PM   #18
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The problem is, we still have major national banks which are insolvent.

This is not Obama's fault.

-spence
Sure it is, the buck stops here remember.

Swimmer a.k.a. YO YO MA
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Old 02-22-2009, 05:11 PM   #19
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Nah, he's having a lot more fun trying to trip it up hoping it's a big failure. I'd be willing to wager he's accused Liberals of doing the exact same thing regarding the war in Iraq.
That would be RIJIMMY
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Old 02-23-2009, 09:00 AM   #20
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you dont read a word I post

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Old 02-23-2009, 09:33 AM   #21
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WASHINGTON (CNN) -- A new national poll indicates that nearly three out of four Americans are scared about the way things are going in the country today.

Seventy-three percent of those questioned in a CNN/Opinion Research Corporation survey released Monday say they're very or somewhat scared about the way things are going in the United States. That's six points higher than in an October poll.

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Old 02-23-2009, 12:47 PM   #22
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Of course, October and November and December were the meltdown months when your hero was under his desk taking a nap...

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Old 02-23-2009, 02:41 PM   #23
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Sure it is, the buck stops here remember.
God I wish it would.

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Old 02-23-2009, 02:54 PM   #24
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Of course, October and November and December were the meltdown months when your hero was under his desk taking a nap...
I think we are at an 11 year low now. All that negative economy doom and gloom talk just might have backfired on Obama. To bad for anyone with a 401K. We need a real plan and we need it soon.
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Old 02-23-2009, 04:25 PM   #25
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I hear after they nationalize Citigroup they are going cut the interest rates on credit cards to not more than 3% above prime. That will spurn consumer spending and free up money for households that carry balances.

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Old 02-24-2009, 08:09 AM   #26
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When GREED and FEAR hit the high notes (It may be Soon), watch for a gradual "capitulation"...i:e: the average Joe throws in the towel in fear of losing more of what he already lost. THEN................
The market makers will spin the first "Good News" headline as marking the bottom of the market. They will raise the market several hundred points over a few weeks, enticing the uninformed into believing the "All Clear" has been signaled and you will begin throwing money back into the market in an attempt to gain what you had lost. At this point, the market makers will pull the rug out from under you by dropping the market several hundred points over a few days and will now have all of your money and your anger. Some will sell out and vow never again while others will be recycled into the same steps as before until the real bottom is formed. (That's when their are no more retail buyers (You) left).
Market makers from Wall Street have some of the most Brilliant Psychologist working in their firms. They know how you think, how you try to reason, and prey on that advantage.
Just my thoughts..
O.K. Back into my Cave.
P.S. It's not all doom and gloom as the patient investor who has that proverbial long term horizon will be O.K. as long as we are the U.S. of A. If that changes, all bets are off.
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Old 02-24-2009, 08:48 AM   #27
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Of course, October and November and December were the meltdown months when your hero was under his desk taking a nap...
Bush is not my hero. But just so you know, its Congress's job to introduce leglislation and last I checked we had democrat congress for the last 2 years. What where they up to?

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Old 02-24-2009, 09:13 AM   #28
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Bush is not my hero. But just so you know, its Congress's job to introduce leglislation and last I checked we had democrat congress for the last 2 years. What where they up to?
Waiting for Bush to leave, so they can spend money we don't have.

Can't wait for the speach tonight. My prediction the Dow drops 200 or more tomorrow.
Funny how a speach can effect it, but the promise of a trillion dollars takes a long time to effect it.

Let me wrap up the speach for you, "Bush's fault", we need to control the deficit, I will spend billions and billions.
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Old 02-24-2009, 09:25 AM   #29
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I fell so much better that most of my money is invested in custom plugs and not some wacky retirement plan.

Conservatism is not about leaving people behind. Conservatism is about empowering people to catch up, to give them tools at their disposal that make it possible for them to access all the hope, all the promise, all the opportunity that America offers. - Marco Rubio
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Old 02-24-2009, 09:58 AM   #30
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Waiting for Bush to leave, so they can spend money we don't have.

Can't wait for the speach tonight. My prediction the Dow drops 200 or more tomorrow.
Funny how a speach can effect it, but the promise of a trillion dollars takes a long time to effect it.

Let me wrap up the speach for you, "Bush's fault", we need to control the deficit, I will spend billions and billions.

It will be an interesting discussion, particularly with a nationalized financial market.
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