alternative to wall

[Got Stripers]

DC won’t need snow plows, the Oval Office melt down will take care of it, the twitter storm might be more severe today.
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[Got Stripers]

I’m not on a side as an independent and frankly what concerns me more than a real immigration problem I’ve acknowledged we have at the southern border, is the mounting evidence Trump may have had more than just a budding browmance with Putin. We are talking about a national security crisis at our border, when the farther we get into the mueller investigation and mounting evidence that not only did Russia influence the 2016 election, that the Trump family may have had reasons to possibly assist in those efforts. The wall is a distraction because the walls may be closing in on the Don’s family business.
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

I’m not on a side as an independent and frankly what concerns me more than a real immigration problem I’ve acknowledged we have at the southern border, is the mounting evidence Trump may have had more than just a budding browmance with Putin. We are talking about a national security crisis at our border, when the farther we get into the mueller investigation and mounting evidence that not only did Russia influence the 2016 election, that the Trump family may have had reasons to possibly assist in those efforts. The wall is a distraction because the walls may be closing in on the Don’s family business.
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The wall may be an attempt to get Mueller off the front page. That doesn't mean it won't help innocent people. We can secure our borders, and investigate Trump. No need to do those things consecutively.

[Sea Dangles]

On one hand we have a problem with ILLEGAL entry and on the other hand we have speculation of Trump being directly involved with Russian collusion. We will see how real this Trump collusion turns out but my guess is this will be another nothing burger,similar to the Kavanaugh democratic debacle. Regardless,a wall would be an effective means of keeping ILLEAGALS out. Unfortunately half the nation would rather chase a ghost,similar to the previous distraction where the democrats threw a hissy fit and made up stories about a Supreme Court nominee. This is where we are as a nation politically.
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Sea Dangles

On one hand we have a problem with ILLEGAL entry and on the other hand we have speculation of Trump being directly involved with Russian collusion. We will see how real this Trump collusion turns out but my guess is this will be another nothing burger,similar to the Kavanaugh democratic debacle. Regardless,a wall would be an effective means of keeping ILLEAGALS out. Unfortunately half the nation would rather chase a ghost,similar to the previous distraction where the democrats threw a hissy fit and made up stories about a Supreme Court nominee. This is where we are as a nation politically.
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Trump must be salivating at even the thought of being able to replace Ginsberg. I hope she lives to be 100, but I hope she retires tomorrow, so he can nominate Amy Barrett a devout Catholic, and we can all see, once and for all, how tolerant these liberals are and how much they sincerely advocate for women.

[Nebe]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Trump must be salivating at even the thought of being able to replace Ginsberg. I hope she lives to be 100, but I hope she retires tomorrow, so he can nominate Amy Barrett a devout Catholic, and we can all see, once and for all, how tolerant these liberals are and how much they sincerely advocate for women.

Separation of church and state mean anything to you?
I doubt it.
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Nebe

Separation of church and state mean anything to you?

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It does. But unlike you, I know what it means. It means that there will be no official state religion. It does NOT mean that religiously-informed consciences, cannot influence public policy. It does NOT men, that religious people are required to leave their religion outside of public service.

Religiously-motivated people ended slavery and segregation.

[Pete F.]

I spent years on school boards, not nearly as complicated as Congress but we received each year budgets from administration that we reviewed, if something went up we asked for and got an explanation. Trump DHS budget prior to his added demands had gone up 7.3% from the previous year and I think then very late in the game he added more.
I attached the 2019 proposed budget from the Trump administration, I see 1.6 billion for new wall,
"• $1.6 billion for 65 miles of new border wall construction in the Rio Grande Valley Sector to deny access to drug trafficking organizations and illegal migration flows in high traffic
zones where apprehensions are the highest along the Southwest Border. "
How did it change and why?
https://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/fi...BIB%202019.pdf
I find little information on what Trump wants to do, but if this is close to correct it is embarrassing, 6.5M per new hire?
Does anyone honestly think that there will not be a significant loss of personnel with the shutdown to the affected government agencies?

Those eager to help President Trump spend $5 billion girding the southern frontier against largely imaginary threats, and perhaps shut down part of the government to do it, should consider the administration’s stewardship of border security funds so far.

Take, for example, its attempt to dramatically expand the Border Patrol, which has produced a spasm of spending to no apparent avail.

A border surge was such a priority for the president that he made it part of an executive order within a week of his inauguration. The same order that called for the construction of Trump’s oft-promised “big, beautiful” border wall — never mind that, two years later, he has yet to get Congress (or Mexico) to pay for it — also called for adding 5,000 agents to the Border Patrol, a roughly 25 percent increase. And yet a new internal investigation finds that the agency hasn’t begun to effect a hiring spree.

Last year, in a panicked response to Trump’s executive order, U.S. Customs and Border Protection agreed to pay the consulting firm Accenture nearly $300 million over five years to add 7,500 to the payrolls of the Border Patrol and two other agencies. Members of Congress and others soon raised concerns that have now been substantiated by the Homeland Security Department’s inspector general.


Calling for officials’ “immediate attention,” the inspector general’s report says that 10 months into the contract, the government had paid Accenture more than $13 million to complete a grand total of two hires. Moreover, according to the report, the agency was doing much of the work that the company had agreed to do. While Customs and Border Protection maintains that Accenture did put in place a “hiring structure” and lay other important groundwork for recruitment, the time allotted for the startup phase of the contract was only three months, later extended to six months.

The results, or lack thereof, reflect on the administration’s dubious goals as well as its incompetence in implementing them. Even at its current complement, Customs and Border Protection is the largest federal law enforcement agency, having more than doubled in size since 2000 at a time when illegal immigration from Mexico has generally ebbed. The agency also suffers from long-standing hiring and retention difficulties that have left it perpetually lagging the staffing level previously mandated by Congress, let alone exceeding it by 5,000.

Even without wasting another dime on Trump’s multibillion-dollar monument, the federal government has spent lavishly on border security with diminishing returns.

[Got Stripers]

It’s all about the distraction his MO and keeping his base engaged, why more republicans have not abanded the sinking Trump Tower of BS is frankly disturbing and amazing.
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[Got Stripers]

I think Phillip Rivers should take one out of Trumps playbook and refuse to take the field until the offensive line promises him a wall to throw behind🤣.
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[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

I think Phillip Rivers should take one out of Trumps playbook and refuse to take the field until the offensive line promises him a wall to throw behind🤣.
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Good one
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[wdmso]

Where Does Illegal Immigration Mostly Occur?

and the Source for this information Homeland Security


So I guess if you walk to the USA your not welcome if you can afford to fly here we assume your not getting a Government hand out ... so your lower on the list and less likely to be involved in the drug trade or a rapist or a criminal .. so please be patient will deport you once we get rid of those who Walked here 1st...

[Got Stripers]

I really feel for the government workers who are getting a royal screwing over this political BS, but clearly Trump doesn't care. For him to stand there and suggest all these workers are in his corner is just another lie; big shocker there.

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

I really feel for the government workers who are getting a royal screwing over this political BS, but clearly Trump doesn't care. For him to stand there and suggest all these workers are in his corner is just another lie; big shocker there.

He thinks they’re all democratic’s any way

Trumps hurting Americans to help Americans. It’s the same with the farmers

And his supporters have framed everything in literal terms aka wall
Or collusion The details are of no concern
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[Pete F.]

Trumps 2018 HSE budget was 44 Billion
Trumps proposed 2019 HSE budget was 47.5 Billion
What is his current HSE budget?

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Where Does Illegal Immigration Mostly Occur?

and the Source for this information Homeland Security


So I guess if you walk to the USA your not welcome if you can afford to fly here we assume your not getting a Government hand out ... so your lower on the list and less likely to be involved in the drug trade or a rapist or a criminal .. so please be patient will deport you once we get rid of those who Walked here 1st...

Are you trying to say that we should not be trying to do everything we can to stop 304, 000 illegals from trying to cross the southern border because there are supposedly more coming from another direction?

And that 304,000 is APPREHENDED. That doesn't count those many thousands who were not apprehended. It is said that for every one who is apprehended, there is one who isn't.

A USA Today article (Alan Gomez, USA TODAY Published 11:31 a.m. ET May 22, 2017 | Updated 6:21 p.m. ET May 22, 2017) "People who overstay their visas make up an estimated 40% of the 11 million undocumented immigrants who live in the U.S. They are largely overshadowed by undocumented immigrants who cross the southwest border with Mexico."

Trump made an executive order to install a biometric system like one that had been suggested by the 9/11 commission, which Congress approved in 2004 and appropriated funds for it several times, but it was not put in place until Trump did the executive order.

Both problems need to be addressed. It's not one or the other. Trump has instituted a system that Congress approved but didn't make operative. For the southern border, he is trying to make happen that which Congress had previously approved but didn't completely follow through on.

What's your point?

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Are you trying to say that we should not be trying to do everything we can to stop 304, 000 illegals from trying to cross the southern border because there are supposedly more coming from another direction?

And that 304,000 is APPREHENDED. That doesn't count those many thousands who were not apprehended. It is said that for every one who is apprehended, there is one who isn't.

A USA Today article (Alan Gomez, USA TODAY Published 11:31 a.m. ET May 22, 2017 | Updated 6:21 p.m. ET May 22, 2017) "People who overstay their visas make up an estimated 40% of the 11 million undocumented immigrants who live in the U.S. They are largely overshadowed by undocumented immigrants who cross the southwest border with Mexico."

Trump made an executive order to install a biometric system like one that had been suggested by the 9/11 commission, which Congress approved in 2004 and appropriated funds for it several times, but it was not put in place until Trump did the executive order.

Both problems need to be addressed. It's not one or the other. Trump has instituted a system that Congress approved but didn't make operative. For the southern border, he is trying to make happen that which Congress had previously approved but didn't completely follow through on.

What's your point?

Trumps more worried about those who get here via walking that’s all
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[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Trumps more worried about those who get here via walking that’s all
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I don't know who he's more "worried" about. And I don't know why I should care which one he's more worried about. He's addressing both issues with whatever technology is available.

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by detbuch

I don't know who he's more "worried" about. And I don't know why I should care which one he's more worried about. He's addressing both issues with whatever technology is available.

Ok sure he is

[Slipknot]

The recipe goes like this. First, get a Social Security number, then claim the Earned Income Tax Credit for the last three years. Then, wait for the IRS to send you three years of tax refunds. The gambit could apparently work even if you never paid taxes, never filed a return, and worked off the books. And the IRS says this is the way the Earned Income Tax Credit works.

Cautious IRS Commissioner Koskinen himself explained the seemingly bizarre result to Sen. Charles Grassley (R-Iowa) in 2015. Illegal immigrants covered by the President’s amnesty deal can claim back tax credits for work they performed illegally, even if they never filed a tax return during those years. This written response clarified the IRS chief’s earlier statements, confirming that illegals can get back taxes.

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Ok sure he is

When words or evidence fails . . . resort to an emoticon.

[Slipknot]

try reading the article this time, especially last paragraph



This isn’t exactly the kind of story the IRS wants buzzing around at tax time. The IRS and Justice Department normally want 'scared straight' stories just before Tax Day. Ideally, when an indictment or conviction for tax evasion hits the news, it makes you think twice. Somehow, you think just a bit more about all those deductions, or if you really reported all your income, before you sign your return under penalties of perjury.

Instead, we have the top dog at the IRS, the IRS Commissioner himself, admitting that, well, there’s a problem with illegal immigrants and taxes. In fact, the top IRS official this time wasn’t talking about how the IRS wipes some hard drives or can’t find emails. He wasn’t even asking for a bigger budget to give bonuses to IRS employees.


This time, he was talking about illegal immigrants, and about the IRS turning a blind eye. Or maybe worse. The IRS actually wants illegal immigrants to illegally use Social Security numbers, he suggested.
IRS Commissioner John Koskinen made the surprising statement in response to a question from Sen. Dan Coats, R-Ind., at a Senate Finance Committee meeting. The question was a touchy one. Gee, is the IRS collaborating with taxpayers who file tax returns using fraudulent information? It wasn't put exactly that way. According to Senator Coats:



What we learned is that ... the IRS continues to process tax returns with false W-2 information and issue refunds as if they were routine tax returns, and say that's not really our job. We also learned the IRS ignores notifications from the Social Security Administration that a name does not match a Social Security number, and you use your own system to determine whether a number is valid."

Commissioner Koskinen was asked to explain this. He suggested that as long as the information is being used only to fraudulently obtain jobs, the IRS was OK with it. In fact, he said that the IRS actually had an interest in helping the illegal immigrants to crook these rules. In fairness, perhaps it's just the 'that's not my department' response that abounds in big government. Perhaps this just isn't the IRS's problem, but it sure seems odd to have any agency chief encouraging illegal immigrant theft of SSNs.



You'll love this next part. The IRS chief tried to distinguish between the various bad uses and misuses of someone else's personal data. It is at least vaguely reminiscent of the flap a year ago that differentiated President Obama and Donald Trump over immigration and taxes. Mr. Trump said illegal immigrants get $4.2 billion in tax credits. A 2011 audit by the Treasury Inspector General for Tax Administration confirmed that individuals who are not authorized to work in the United States were paid $4.2 billion in refundable credits.

Of course, undocumented immigrants cannot legitimately get Social Security numbers, but it seems the IRS doesn't care. Besides, they can file taxes with an Individual Taxpayer Identification Number. ITIN. They are not supposed to get the Earned Income Tax Credit, but they can receive the additional child tax credit. If the President succeeds in legitimizing the status of illegal immigrants, they could even get the Earned Income Tax Credit that is responsible for billions in fraudulent refunds.


there is more to the article but I already pasted a couple paragraphs

https://www.forbes.com/sites/robertw.../#53a4b8454c04


it's all on the internet spence

[Pete F.]

I saw a suggestion that the government sell Wall Bonds to fund the wall.
If all the people (42% of 250,000,000 eligible voters) who support building a wall bought a $50 bond it would come pretty close to the regime's current demands.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

I saw a suggestion that the government sell Wall Bonds to fund the wall.
If all the people (42% of 250,000,000 eligible voters) who support building a wall bought a $50 bond it would come pretty close to the regime's current demands.

Since the wall will pay for itself, many times over, he could also easily offer a very preferential interest rate.

[Pete F.]

Article published Apr 13, 2016, 03:10am
Is it still true today?

[Slipknot]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

Article published Apr 13, 2016, 03:10am
Is it still true today?

yes, in 2011 an audit by the Treasury Inspector General for Tax Administration confirmed that individuals who are not authorized to work in the United States were paid $4.2 billion in refundable credits. It is still true today
Yes