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Political Threads This section is for Political Threads - Enter at your own risk. If you say you don't want to see what someone posts - don't read it :hihi:

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Old 12-29-2013, 03:46 PM   #1
Tagger
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Geeez ,, no talk of this , Big breaking story today ..

You'll hear it all week . http://finance.yahoo.com/news/bombsh...210144227.html

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Old 12-29-2013, 04:13 PM   #2
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You won't hear any Hillary haters talking about this.
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Old 12-29-2013, 05:01 PM   #3
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New York times report ?
May as well have Chris Matthews do a story on it !
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Old 12-29-2013, 08:37 PM   #4
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60 minutes too .. http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/entert...231145141.html

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Old 12-29-2013, 08:51 PM   #5
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60 minutes CBS liberal ass kissing network just like NBC & ABC
The you got CNN MSLeftBC and the other liberal ass kissing networks.
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Old 12-29-2013, 09:03 PM   #6
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The loyalty of local militias there can change on a whim. Street credibility and respect rise from their "deeds." Not far off from gang turf wars in our cities. Mission was understaffed and had been for a long time. The former SEAL who died there is the son of a fraternity brother, and his sister lives here in town...... It is a suck deal any way you cut it.
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Old 12-29-2013, 11:46 PM   #7
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The nytimes report only helps to confirm the obvious...
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Old 12-30-2013, 07:25 AM   #8
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Quote:
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The nytimes report only helps to confirm the obvious...
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Confirms that liberal rag is part of the cover up
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Old 12-30-2013, 09:07 AM   #9
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60 minutes CBS liberal ass kissing network just like NBC & ABC
The you got CNN MSLeftBC and the other liberal ass kissing networks.
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And the other half kiss whos ass???

Divided we fall.
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Old 12-30-2013, 09:30 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by Raider Ronnie View Post
60 minutes CBS liberal ass kissing network just like NBC & ABC
The you got CNN MSLeftBC and the other liberal ass kissing networks.
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OK Alex Jones. Where do you get your news from then?

Bryan

Originally Posted by #^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&
"For once I agree with Spence. UGH. I just hope I don't get the urge to go start buying armani suits to wear in my shop"
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Old 12-30-2013, 11:21 AM   #11
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OK Alex Jones. Where do you get your news from then?
News? HAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHA

-spence
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Old 12-30-2013, 05:20 PM   #12
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Rep Michael Grimm just said on CNN that it was 100 percent al Qaeda. When pushed for proof he provided nothing but opinion and kept stumbling. He tried to say that if it was A Q or Al Shariah it didn't make a difference bc they communicate.

From the link above -"The Times says that Republicans are confusing local extremist organizations like Ansar al-Shariah for al-Qaeda’s international terrorist network. That organization was planning the attack when the video was released."


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Last edited by PaulS; 12-30-2013 at 05:28 PM..
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Old 12-30-2013, 05:23 PM   #13
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Rep Michael Grimm just said on CNN that it was 100 percent al Qaeda. When pushed for proof he provided nothing but opinion and kept stumbling.
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That's because the months and months of House investigations haven't turned up anything. Where's the Tea Party decrying the waste of taxpayer money???

-spence
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Old 12-30-2013, 05:29 PM   #14
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Geez, give me some time to edit my post.
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Old 12-30-2013, 06:18 PM   #15
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The accuracy of the article is in question.

http://www.gopusa.com/news/2013/12/3.../?subscriber=1

There are also some internal contradictions in the article as well as contradictions of previous NY Times articles. That the reporter interviewed all those folks with his pointed questions this long after the event and considering the threat any of them would be under if they expressed any incriminating "facts," and considering a Muslim tenet that lying to one's enemy is a tactic not a sin, it would have been extraordinary if there would have been much "revelation" in the answers to the questions. Nor does the article clear the administration of bungling the affair in terms of what has been pointed out ad nauseam as their lack of proper response, etc. It seems to be an attempt to clear the way for Hillary.

Nor does it explain why the administration kept changing its story and why it didn't stick to its original assertion that the attack was solely about a video. Nor of what importance it is, if true, which is in question, that it was solely local militias with no al Qaida influence. As Hillary might say--what's the difference?!! The embassy was ill-prepared against such an attack no matter by who, and, as the NY Times article points out, there were warnings.

Last edited by detbuch; 12-30-2013 at 07:53 PM..
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Old 12-31-2013, 10:25 AM   #16
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You won't hear any Hillary haters talking about this.
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Fine, I'm a Hilary-hater, let's talk about it. I want the truth here as much as anyone. If it wasn't Al Queda, let's say it, learn what we need to learn from it, and try to make sure it doesn't happen again.

That doesn't absolve her from her pathetic screeching "what diference does it make" at the hearings. These were her employees at the time, and she says, on the record, that it makes no difference to her whether they were murdered by terrorists or if they died of natural causes.

If you're OK with that, that's your right. Many people find it repugnant, almost as vile as her lies about being shot at in Kosovo or wherever. How does THAT not end your career, how do you come back from that lie? Easy, I guess, if your name is Clinton or Kennedy...
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Old 12-31-2013, 10:28 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by detbuch View Post
The accuracy of the article is in question.

http://www.gopusa.com/news/2013/12/3.../?subscriber=1
GOPUSA? Really???

Quote:
Nor does it explain why the administration kept changing its story and why it didn't stick to its original assertion that the attack was solely about a video.
The initial story was that the video sparked the event and extremists quickly moved in. That fit with the evidence at the time. Nothing has really contradicted this and the NYT story seems to give it additional credibility.

-spence
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Old 12-31-2013, 10:37 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by Jim in CT View Post
That doesn't absolve her from her pathetic screeching "what diference does it make" at the hearings. These were her employees at the time, and she says, on the record, that it makes no difference to her whether they were murdered by terrorists or if they died of natural causes.
That's not at all what she said, once again Jim your opinion appears to be formed from snippets rather than due diligence.

So goes the way of the world.

-spence
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Old 12-31-2013, 10:49 AM   #19
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That's not at all what she said, once again Jim your opinion appears to be formed from snippets rather than due diligence.

So goes the way of the world.

-spence
Here is what she said, when pressed about whether the attack was sparked by terrorism or the video...

"“What difference, at this point, does it make?”"

Here's the answer...the truth matters. Especially in these situations...do you tell your kids differently, Spence? Do you tel your kids to only tell the truth when it's convenient? And to lie when lying is more convenient?

http://thehill.com/homenews/news/193...quotes-of-2013

Tell me where I am wrong, please?
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Old 12-31-2013, 10:52 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by Jim in CT View Post
Here is what she said, when pressed about whether the attack was sparked by terrorism or the video...

"“What difference, at this point, does it make?”"

Here's the answer...the truth matters. Especially in these situations...do you tell your kids differently, Spence? Do you tel your kids to only tell the truth when it's convenient? And to lie when lying is more convenient?

http://thehill.com/homenews/news/193...quotes-of-2013

Tell me where I am wrong, please?
Yep, so you try and prove your point by referencing yet another snippet taken out of context. Read the full transcript...

-spence
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Old 12-31-2013, 11:39 AM   #21
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Yep, so you try and prove your point by referencing yet another snippet taken out of context. Read the full transcript...

-spence
First, you claimed that she didn't say what I claimed she said. Then, after I proved she said what I claimed, you say that I'm taking it out of context. Keep moving the goalposts, Spence!

Spence, I have seen the video. Please put her remarks in a context that's more benign than I made it out to be. I'm all ears...
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Old 12-31-2013, 02:04 PM   #22
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GOPUSA? Really???

The New York Times? Really???

How about dropping the snobbery bit and explain what is wrong with the article?


The initial story was that the video sparked the event and extremists quickly moved in.

Interesting. So, wasn't the supposed initial reaction to the video by "extremists." Or did some regular non-extreme folks somehow just happen to get wind of the video and this somehow sparked an event composed by regular non-extreme folks who wanted to stage a peaceful nicey-nice demonstration which was then "quickly" moved in on by unaware, unprepared, and fully armed "actual" extremists? Really???

That fit with the evidence at the time. Nothing has really contradicted this and the NYT story seems to give it additional credibility.

-spence
Amazing how something can be made to "fit with the evidence." Isn't that usually the case when you attempt to create a story of deniable plausibility? Yes, things have really contradicted the "fit with the evidence." But it is apparently useless to hash it out once again since any contradictory "evidence" seems to fall on deaf or unreceptive ears.
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Old 12-31-2013, 03:14 PM   #23
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First, you claimed that she didn't say what I claimed she said. Then, after I proved she said what I claimed, you say that I'm taking it out of context. Keep moving the goalposts, Spence!

Spence, I have seen the video. Please put her remarks in a context that's more benign than I made it out to be. I'm all ears...
No, you claimed she said it didn't matter, that's not true...read Jim, think...do a little homework. Have an open mind...

-spence
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Old 12-31-2013, 03:30 PM   #24
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The New York Times? Really???

How about dropping the snobbery bit and explain what is wrong with the article?
Snobbery? I think the NYT still has some pretty credible journalistic standards. Your GOP site is just regurgitating remarks from House members, the basis of which have gone nowhere in their "investigation."

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Interesting. So, wasn't the supposed initial reaction to the video by "extremists." Or did some regular non-extreme folks somehow just happen to get wind of the video and this somehow sparked an event composed by regular non-extreme folks who wanted to stage a peaceful nicey-nice demonstration which was then "quickly" moved in on by unaware, unprepared, and fully armed "actual" extremists? Really???
I think the NYT piece captures the most likely scenario pretty well.

Quote:
Amazing how something can be made to "fit with the evidence." Isn't that usually the case when you attempt to create a story of deniable plausibility? Yes, things have really contradicted the "fit with the evidence." But it is apparently useless to hash it out once again since any contradictory "evidence" seems to fall on deaf or unreceptive ears.
State took a lot of grief over this event from the non-partisan investigations already complete.

So far, what we've seen is a strained attempt to fit the facts with a conspiracy theory that's gone no where.

-spence
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Old 12-31-2013, 04:41 PM   #25
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No, you claimed she said it didn't matter, that's not true...read Jim, think...do a little homework. Have an open mind...

-spence
ok, I claimed she said "it doesn't matter", when what she said was, "what difference does it make".

Now. Spence. Please. Tell. Me. Where. I. Was.. Wrong.

See? I even used monosyllabic words, so that even you would have a chance of understanding the question! You're welcome!
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Old 12-31-2013, 06:43 PM   #26
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Snobbery? I think the NYT still has some pretty credible journalistic standards. Your GOP site is just regurgitating remarks from House members, the basis of which have gone nowhere in their "investigation."

Yes, it is snobbery to dismiss an article because you have a low opinion of the source. You don't address anything in the article--just poo-poo it because it's GOPUSA which has had many very interesting, accurate, and informative articles. Of course, if you don't read it, it ain't no good.

And how do you know where the House investigation has gone? It hasn't been finished and classified intel has not been released. One of those on the committee, Adam Schiff DEMOCRAT disputes the accuracy of the article saying there was an Al Qaeda connection with the militia groups involved in the attack. And he said "The intelligence indicates that Al Qaeda was involved."


I think the NYT piece captures the most likely scenario pretty well.

It is too selective and leaves out too much. It doesn't have access to the House intel info. It doesn't recognize the affiliation between Al Qaeda and Ansar al Sharia

On the other hand the article disputes the Administration's initial claim that the attack was spontaneous--"The attack does not appear to have been meticulously planned, but neither was it spontaneous or without warning signs." No, it wasn't planned to the T like a master military operation, but it was deliberately unleashed at a certain time and place to instigate an inflamed rabble, and who were probably "informed" about the video by "extremists" who were looking for another "spontaneous spark" to riot like those they had already inspired in Egypt and other parts of Libya. And the "spontaneous" rioters, as the Times article reveals, were directed by various militia lieutenants both in allowing the rioters inside the havoc and keeping out anyone who might stop them.

Abu Khattala, the leader of one of the militias, claims not to be affiliated with Al Qaeda but admires it and what it does. He is still, to this day, freely roaming the streets of Benghazi in spite of his being a major instigator. The article quotes four who were interviewed under anonymity because they were afraid of repercussions. How much actual truth can you get from those who fear for their lives?

Ansar Al Sharia is an affiliate of Al Qaeda and was implicated even by the article in the attack. And it had been forming in Libya for some time before the attack.

According to the Washington Times (Omigosh, Really???) "The FBI, which was tasked by the Obama Administration concluded the attack was carried out by a combination of militants with varying degrees of connection to three Islamist groups: Ansar Al Sharia The Muhammad Jamal network, and Al Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb."

The NY Times article is helpful in showing how a lack of security leads to tragedy and how gullible trust in Islamic factions revealed the dangerous lack of understanding of the volatile situation the administration was dealing with. The total disregard for connection between various "militant" groups and the major umbrella of ideology inspired by larger Islamic organizations such as Al Qaeda had to be denied in order to carry out the mission in such an unprepared, naively idealistic, rather foolish way. The Benghazi incident was a total bungle, not just by Dept. of State headed by Hillary, but by the Administration as a whole

The refusal to understand the implicit cohesion among "militant" or "extreme" Islamic groups toward the global jihad creates trusts which lead to tragedy. Not understanding the basic religious connection between differing Islamist groups in their mission to bring down the West is an incompetent view which only aids their mission. And it is known that Al Qaeda's, jihadist goals have over the past couple of years been implemented by affiliated groups inspired by Al Qaeda and many of whose leaders came directly from Al Qaeda. It was Bin Laden's plan that his mission was to be carried out by Muslims worldwide, regardless of local affiliations, which would eventually erupt in global jihad.


State took a lot of grief over this event from the non-partisan investigations already complete.

Blaming State and absolving its boss is political whitewash. Apparently the buck in this administration always stops at lower levels. Leading from behind, no doubt.

So far, what we've seen is a strained attempt to fit the facts with a conspiracy theory that's gone no where.

-spence
The NY Times article which you claim captures the most likely scenario does not preclude a conspiracy. It tries to minimize it and distance it from major Islamist "extremists." And it doesn't mention the name Hillary Clinton.

Last edited by detbuch; 01-02-2014 at 01:38 PM..
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Old 01-03-2014, 10:33 AM   #27
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The NY Times article which you claim captures the most likely scenario does not preclude a conspiracy. It tries to minimize it and distance it from major Islamist "extremists." And it doesn't mention the name Hillary Clinton.
Ahhh yes, the old "it hasn't been totally dis-proven either" argument. Let's just keep looking until we find the smoking gun, or the 2016 election...which ever comes sooner.

I don't think the NYT report is dismissive of alQaeda links at all, rather, they get down to what it really means. Sharing some common viewpoints isn't an "affiliation". Having some level of acquaintance isn't "coordination". The important question is if core alQaeda influenced/funded/collaborated etc... in the attack. I've still not seen anything that indicated this is the case.

alQaeda seems to have become almost a generic word for terrorism when it suits the agenda.

Good perspective here...

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blog...-al-qaeda.html

The article doesn't contradict the Administration's initial claims of the video, if anything it bolsters them. There appears to be substantial evidence indicating the video played a role, likely the timing for the attack which had only been loosely planned to that point. The fact that heavily armed extremists quickly moved in was a central line to the Administration narrative from the beginning...

-spence
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Old 01-03-2014, 11:00 AM   #28
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Atleast we moved beyond the issue of who changed the talking points.
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Old 01-03-2014, 11:12 AM   #29
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It was George Bush's fault!!!!
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Old 01-03-2014, 12:14 PM   #30
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Atleast we moved beyond the issue of who changed the talking points.
I'm sure Jim will get us back full circle.

-spence
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