More (Bad News) on Groundfishing

[BasicPatrick]

The emergency Measures announced last week were just the first shoe to drop.

I am at the Council meeting in RI right now. The New England Fishery Management Council is currently working on an action called Framework 53. Today they had very little option but to pass a motion to end "overfishing" of Gulf of Maine Cod in 2015, which meant approving a total overall ABC (acceptable biological catch) of 376 metric tons (or something like that). For comparison I think the starting ABC last year was 1550 metric tons.

There are not many options right now but there will be many debates that will happen tomorrow (Wed Nov 19 at the Newport Marriott). Among the options for recreational (private and for hire) is a pretty straight up copy of the Emergency Action measures...zero possession of cod and 2-3 haddock with all recreational ground fishing only to occur outside of rolling closed areas (pretty much where we fish when we fish).

Some people got mad at me today because I went to the mic and agreed that cod are in the toilet. Oh well. Its the truth and has been for a few years. I don't care whose fault it is as that argument gets us nowhere and Id rather spend my time trying to figure out how we can have measures that allow some recreational ground fishing. The dragger fleet is trying to argue the science is wrong and there are lots of cod but they aren't getting anywhere from my point of view. They are getting press but no solutions thus far.

As far as why the recreational fleet is not getting the increase in haddock that is being reported in the press...in some ways we are. I say that because the 2014 recreational "catch" (kept fish plus discard mortality) was more than 200% of our 30% sub ACL (annual catch limit) of haddock. We were also over on cod. Because of this the AM (accountability measure) has to be regulations that will not allow us to go over our sub ACL for the next fishing year which starts on May 1 2015. When they add the discard mortality of cod caught and discarded while haddock fishing the analysis ends up giving us a measure of zero retention of cod and a 2-3 haddock bag limit...but our discard mortality of cod will still be larger than our sub ACL. As proposed we are screwed.

It might be even get worse before it gets better as no one has even publically discussed pollock yet except that we can't fish for ground fish inside the rolling closed areas and that includes pollock.

Yes, Tuna fishing is allowed inside the rolling closed areas.

Tomorrow we see if we can get something different considered. Im working with a few people to try and get them to analyze a zero discard/combined bag limit where we keep every cod, haddock and if they bring it up maybe pollock until the bag limit is reached. Once an anger reached the bag limit we have to stop fishing for the day. Maybe it could get us up to a bag limit of 5-6 fish but no way to know if we can even get that considered.

Im sure some of the state people have ideas as well. At least I hope they do. Who knows at this point. I just hope people aren't thinking that after May 1 we are going back to 2014 regulations because that isn't going to happen.

That all i got. Will check in later in the week.
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[Jackbass]

"I don't care whose fault it is as that argument gets us nowhere "
I would like to say I'm surprised and I agree with you're above sentiment.
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[thefishingfreak]

Thank you for all the hard work on this issue Patrick.

[Piscator]

Good update and thanks for the info. Was there any discussion about the Stellwagen Bank Designated Habitat Research Area ("DHRA") that will close 55 square miles of fishing to all (is the proposal to close it for just ground fish or Pelagic fish as well and are there any details on that)?
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[MakoMike]

FWIW, the discard mortality in the haddock fishery was the reason John Bullard cited for not increasing the recreational sub ACL in the emergency measure.

[JohnR]

Less fish: The science is wrong

Less fish: The science is wrong

Less fish: The science is wrong

No fish: How could you guys let this happn?

Originally Posted by Jackbass

"I don't care whose fault it is as that argument gets us nowhere "
I would like to say I'm surprised and I agree with you're above sentiment.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Yep

Originally Posted by thefishingfreak

Thank you for all the hard work on this issue Patrick.

[PaulS]

Originally Posted by JohnR

Less fish: The science is wrong

Less fish: The science is wrong

Less fish: The science is wrong

No fish: How could you guys let this happn?

Greed?

[DZ]

I've always wondered about recreational discards. Seems most of that groundfish fishery is in fairly deep waters. At what depth is it impossible for a cod, haddock, pollock to survive a hook and line release?

[zimmy]

Originally Posted by JohnR

Less fish: The science is wrong

Less fish: The science is wrong

Less fish: The science is wrong

No fish: How could you guys let this happn?

Exactly

[FishermanTim]

Originally Posted by JohnR

Less fish: The science is wrong

Less fish: The science is wrong

Less fish: The science is wrong

No fish: How could you guys let this happn? :

100% spot on!!!

Thanks for the info!

[thefishingfreak]

Originally Posted by DZ

I've always wondered about recreational discards. Seems most of that groundfish fishery is in fairly deep waters. At what depth is it impossible for a cod, haddock, pollock to survive a hook and line release?

Not at all. I would say a great % of the fish that are caught in the lip, and released quickly, survive.
With Cod, If the water is over 250 feet +/- there air bladder will keep them from returning to the bottom. a little squeeze and "fart" is all it takes to get them right back down.
Haddock don't have an air bladder, so this is a non issue at any depth. They will return right to the bottom.
The larger Pollack 10lbs +/- in over 400' will die. there air bladder is deep inside there spine and you can't "fart" out a big Pollack.
the little ones don't seem to have a problem rocketing back to the bottom.

As someone who holds a handgear permit and sells groundfish every chance I get, I will admit the cod are just not around. I have sat on anchor tuna fishing in once prime areas, NWC, NEC, Jeffreys, etc.. for 3 days at a time for the past 4 years and struggle to fill a now 25 pound per day cod quota and a 75 pound per day haddock quota.

[DZ]

Originally Posted by thefishingfreak

Not at all. I would say a great % of the fish that are caught in the lip, and released quickly, survive.
With Cod, If the water is over 250 feet +/- there air bladder will keep them from returning to the bottom. a little squeeze and "fart" is all it takes to get them right back down.
Haddock don't have an air bladder, so this is a non issue at any depth. They will return right to the bottom.
The larger Pollack 10lbs +/- in over 400' will die. there air bladder is deep inside there spine and you can't "fart" out a big Pollack.
the little ones don't seem to have a problem rocketing back to the bottom.

As someone who holds a handgear permit and sells groundfish every chance I get, I will admit the cod are just not around. I have sat on anchor tuna fishing in once prime areas, NWC, NEC, Jeffreys, etc.. for 3 days at a time for the past 4 years and struggle to fill a now 25 pound per day cod quota and a 75 pound per day haddock quota.

Thanks fishbucket.

[niko]

Originally Posted by DZ

I've always wondered about recreational discards. Seems most of that groundfish fishery is in fairly deep waters. At what depth is it impossible for a cod, haddock, pollock to survive a hook and line release?

the most recent science puts the release mortality at 20% for cod - and it looks like solid science

[MakoMike]

Originally Posted by DZ

I've always wondered about recreational discards. Seems most of that groundfish fishery is in fairly deep waters. At what depth is it impossible for a cod, haddock, pollock to survive a hook and line release?

Just did a little research, the survival rate for released haddock is very high, no matter the depth. Seems to be that over 90% of the fish, if treated properly will survive.

[beamie]

Correct me if I am wrong but the Federal Rolling Closure goes ALL THE WAY to the coast, superceeding state groundfishing areas. I know that was the case for Commercial Fishing. But how about for recreational / for hire fishing 'non sale' in state waters?

[thefishingfreak]

Originally Posted by beamie

Correct me if I am wrong but the Federal Rolling Closure goes ALL THE WAY to the coast, superceeding state groundfishing areas. I know that was the case for Commercial Fishing. But how about for recreational / for hire fishing 'non sale' in state waters?

In state waters, true recreational fishermen are allowed 2 fish per person, up to 75 pounds per boat, Nov1'st-April 15'th(outside the winter closure- CCZ)(Boston light up to Marblehead)

Charter/Partyboat is closed, per state regs (Sept 1'st)

[DZ]

I read the local paper this morning which had a small article about yesterdays meeting held here in Newport. It mentioned closing certain areas to all commercial cod fishing but allowing recreational fishing but only for "catch and release". Also mentioned that lobstering in those areas will still be permitted - I guess there was some who thought lobstering should also be banned because the pots also catch cod.

[stripermaineiac]

LOL none of it will work as long as they give the netters a 200 lb dayly catch limit. That just means more trown over the side dead for seagulls an crabs to eat. I got the chance to see itn ist hand when they gave them the 400 lb daily catch limit. a freind of mine asked me to give him a hand for a few days till he found a new deck hand. 1 day was all it took for me to tell him I was done.3000 plus a net load. We threw more than half back in. loads of small size by catch. Gonna be the same just worse numbers. SAD SAD

[thefishingfreak]

Yes true. It's not a ban on fishing it's a ban on selling
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[Piscator]

If that DHRA passes it will be a complete ban on ground fishing in the 55 square mile area (probably forever)
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[MakoMike]

Originally Posted by thefishingfreak

Yes true. It's not a ban on fishing it's a ban on selling
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No, its a ban on fishing when it comes to the closed areas.