Never in my lifetime would i think that the Swiss would do that. Bravo to them.

and i’ve seen congressional republicans say confidently that the global sanctions will clobber russia

seems like sanctions never do what we hope they’ll do, usually they pulverize the innocent citizens and don’t effect the leaders much who are wealthy regardless. would be nice if these sanctions hurt Putin.

scary stuff.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

How come no word about the Turkish drones the UKR has? Wonder if they have been ineffective?


Extremely effective. They need more of these than anything.



PETE, THIS IS THE UKRAINE THREAD

Take your Trump hate and go elsewhere, or that thread.

The fact that Switzerland has broken with the past, and for the first time, frozen accounts, in line with EU sanctions is a huge development.




^^^^ This


Scary that now Putin is really in a bad position and the influx of supplies and troops seems to indicate a renewed commitment to take the capital city. I certainly hope all the new sanctions and arms aid help them hold Russia a bay long enough for the impact in Russia to start to make him think twice about going further.

I hope he does not retaliate or escalate. There is still a ton of #^&#^&#^&#^& he can do. Make sure you keep your heating tanks and gas tanks full, and have some cash when the ATM's don't work.

And for all of the No Fly Zone talk, enforcing it starts WWIII

Extremely effective. They need more of these than anything.








^^^^ This




I hope he does not retaliate or escalate. There is still a ton of #^&#^&#^&#^& he can do. Make sure you keep your heating tanks and gas tanks full, and have some cash when the ATM's don't work.

And for all of the No Fly Zone talk, enforcing it starts WWIII

Only an idiot would consider a no fly zone as helpful.

PETE, THIS IS THE UKRAINE THREAD

Take your Trump hate and go elsewhere, or that thread.

The fact that Switzerland has broken with the past, and for the first time, frozen accounts, in line with EU sanctions is a huge development.

I don’t hate him, I see him for what he is and has always been.

You can watch the clips of him and his enablers being used by Russian State TV against Ukraine, great job

https://twitter.com/projectlincoln/status/1498036538126618626?s=21
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

and i’ve seen congressional republicans say confidently that the global sanctions will clobber russia

seems like sanctions never do what we hope they’ll do, usually they pulverize the innocent citizens and don’t effect the leaders much who are wealthy regardless. would be nice if these sanctions hurt Putin.

scary stuff.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Unfortunately the only way the sanctions work is if they hit the Russian people, Putin owns the oligarchs, he gave them control of the means of production and has the upper hand. They can’t and won’t revolt.
When all the “peasants” are mad, no one can protect you.
A little Russian history would show you that.
Of course, if you think the Russians were better off with the Tsar’s benevolent rule…..you probably think Putin’s a good guy.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I hope he does not retaliate or escalate.
The way things are going today it looks like escalation is already underway. Maybe he just wants to extract a million pounds of flesh before declaring victory to the Russian people. Then he'll look for another target and wave his nukies in everyone's face for the next 20 years.

Did you see the video of the Ukrainian Ambassador reading the text from the soon to be dead Russian soldier? Pretty disturbing unless it was disinformation.

CPAC 2022: US conservatives show little interest in Ukraine


Some of the top Republican officeholders in the party, like Florida's Governor Ron DeSantis, Texas Senator Ted Cruz and Florida Senator Rick Scott, didn't mention Ukraine at all in their speeches.

Why is That

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-60559403

and Here's another ongoing Lie from Our friends on the right

Rep. Andrew Clyde to Newsmax: Biden's Energy Policy 'Took Away Club' Against Russia

"This goes back to Inauguration Day when President Biden specifically targeted his own personal war on the United States' oil and gas industry,

"If the United States had a robust energy policy where we could be net energy exporters, then we could take away that leverage that Russia has," Clyde continued. "Russia never would have invaded Ukraine if we would have had that robust energy policy in place, because we could have crushed them immediately."

Clyde said. "He's the leader of the free world and he's going to lead, but he's not doing that very well."


seem the world disagrees :btu:
Question for him and for those who believe him.. 1st All this in under a year ?

What active oil pumping well did he shut down on Inauguration Day?

Why has No Republican Asked any us oil producers to do their part and increase oil output


no they do this
Senators to President Biden: Why Are You Favoring OPEC Oil over American Oil?

Stating the administration continues to block new federal oil and gas leasing at home.

More BS from the Right
As of January 2021, nearly half (47.4 percent) of the oil and gas industry's public land leases are sitting idle. These idle leases cover 9.9 million acres of national public lands in the West.


November 2021, which is the last data set available, the US imported 254,162,000 barrels of oil. It consumes a stunning 17.2 million barrels per day, much more than the just over 3 million of Russia.

The vast majority is from Canada, 136,090,000, making up over 50 percent of all imports. From Russia, 17,855,000 barrels were imported,

Below is what we have imported from Russia yearly since 2015
But But Biden

https://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/hist/LeafHandler.ashx?n=PET&s=MTTIM_NUS-NRS_1&f=A

2015 135,247 2016 161,286 2017 142,011 2018 137,010 2019 189,786 2020 197,720

Russia is using controversial 'cluster munitions'

I did see some video a few days ago and said to myself that lots like A cluster Bomb

Fox has been showing Drone footage but with no commentary on whos it is Russian or Ukraine


And Much of the video of these attacked armor columns looks as if the had contact and the russians just opened the door and ran Off ?

not seeing many pictures of Dead or captured Russians after these engagements .. Just odd t me

Only an idiot would consider a no fly zone as helpful.


Well, there are a LOT of idiots out there.


The way things are going today it looks like escalation is already underway. Maybe he just wants to extract a million pounds of flesh before declaring victory to the Russian people. Then he'll look for another target and wave his nukies in everyone's face for the next 20 years.

Yes, it's bad.

Did you see the video of the Ukrainian Ambassador reading the text from the soon to be dead Russian soldier? Pretty disturbing unless it was disinformation.

That image was rumored generated on 4chan, so an unwitting amplification of disinfo.


Russia is using controversial 'cluster munitions'

I did see some video a few days ago and said to myself that lots like A cluster Bomb

Fox has been showing Drone footage but with no commentary on whos it is Russian or Ukraine


And Much of the video of these attacked armor columns looks as if the had contact and the russians just opened the door and ran Off ?

not seeing many pictures of Dead or captured Russians after these engagements .. Just odd t me

Seeing a lot of dead russian units, not seeing much of ukraine. Also seeing some that are being claimed by both, and a lot of repurposed videos. Ukraine is certainly winning the public information war.

40 mile covey coming I hope they received some more munitions they are goin* to need them.

Ukraine invasion: Videos show locals confronting Russian forces

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-europe-60558621



The best one is. the women trying to give the Russian Soldier Sunflower seeds She says so when they die they'll Grow

Putin just claimed Ukraine at the US Military direction is staging their weapons in civilian areas …. All ready spinning the upcoming block by block destruction

Plus he’s de-Nazifying’ Ukraine

Seems the Russians have moved into Attacking City Center with Heavy Arms



Russia’s defence ministry is warning residents in Kyiv to leave their homes as it plans to strike targets in the Ukrainian capital, Russian state news agency Tass is reporting.

In a statement issued on Tuesday afternoon, the defence ministry says Russian forces are preparing to launch “high-precision strikes” against the “Security Service of Ukraine (SBU) and the 72nd Center for Information and Psychological Operations (PSO)“ in Kyiv.

We urge Ukrainian citizens involved by Ukrainian nationalists in provocations against Russia, as well as Kiev residents living near relay stations, to leave their homes.

Ukraine invasion: Videos show locals confronting Russian forces

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-europe-60558621



The best one is. the women trying to give the Russian Soldier Sunflower seeds She says so when they die they'll Grow

people will be talking about her for 100 years.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Only an idiot would consider a no fly zone as helpful.

I disagree 100%. Yesterday and today the talk is of the 40 mile convoy. Their progress could be stopped, dead in their tracks with a wing of A-10s or other NATO aircraft. (I am shocked the roads have not been destroyed by the UKR ahead of the advance.) This heavy convoy presents a perfect target. Mark my words, we will relish getting a second chance at a shot like this... The time is slipping away.

[QUOTE=JohnR;1223485}
And for all of the No Fly Zone talk, enforcing it starts WWIII[/QUOTE]

It already has... That is the brutal truth. One last chance for total cease of operations and retreat, or else. We are there! No one wants to say it. But we are. Need to stop that particular battle group/convoy as effectively as possible. Because the chemical, thermobaric, and nukes are going to be used.

I disagree 100%. Yesterday and today the talk is of the 40 mile convoy. Their progress could be stopped, dead in their tracks with a wing of A-10s or other NATO aircraft. (I am shocked the roads have not been destroyed by the UKR ahead of the advance.) This heavy convoy presents a perfect target. Mark my words, we will relish getting a second chance at a shot like this... The time is slipping away.


I had questioned why they hadn’t mined or dug up roads or placed barricades . But their leadership didn’t believe it was coming. They dropped the ball and now the want to be rescued by the west .

But sadly the loss of life in Ukraine will be horrible.! But if we or nato get involved it will jump 10 fold

Its a horrible way to look at it.
Yet it might be the responsible thing to do
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

It already has... That is the brutal truth. One last chance for total cease of operations and retreat, or else. We are there! No one wants to say it. But we are. Need to stop that particular battle group/convoy as effectively as possible. Because the chemical, thermobaric, and nukes are going to be used.


As long as NATO is not in contact with RUS then no, we are not in WWIII. People need to understand that Russia is showing major weakness right now with conventional forces but they still have thousands of nukes. If they were not a nuclear power things would be different. If NATO and Russian forces go to war, a lot more people are going to die, with a decent chance everyone does.

Years ago there was a theory postulated called the MARS theory.
Stands for the Mass Annulation Retaliation Syndrome. Basically, if a nuclear power pushes the button, then everyone will and .......

Years ago there was a theory postulated called the MARS theory.
Stands for the Mass Annulation Retaliation Syndrome. Basically, if a nuclear power pushes the button, then everyone will and .......

Yup if one goes, we all go, I’m hoping Putin isn’t off his kgb nut.

I disagree 100%. Yesterday and today the talk is of the 40 mile convoy. Their progress could be stopped, dead in their tracks with a wing of A-10s or other NATO aircraft. (I am shocked the roads have not been destroyed by the UKR ahead of the advance.) This heavy convoy presents a perfect target. Mark my words, we will relish getting a second chance at a shot like this... The time is slipping away.
Sounds like the convoy isn't moving very well at least for now. Reports of shortages of gas, food, morale is getting low and even some disabling their vehicles and walking away.

Saw a great video a guy took when he pulled up to a stopped armored personnel carrier in a town. He asks if they've broken down, the response no, we just ran out of gas. The driver asks if they need to be towed back to Russia and they just laughed.

John Bolton made a remark that a big reason for the timing of the invasion was simply that Russia wasn't ready. That seems clear.

Sounds like the convoy isn't moving very well at least for now. Reports of shortages of gas, food, morale is getting low and even some disabling their vehicles and walking away.

Saw a great video a guy took when he pulled up to a stopped armored personnel carrier in a town. He asks if they've broken down, the response no, we just ran out of gas. The driver asks if they need to be towed back to Russia and they just laughed.

John Bolton made a remark that a big reason for the timing of the invasion was simply that Russia wasn't ready. That seems clear.

So if it's clear that Russia isn't ready, then why did they invade?

So if it's clear that Russia isn't ready, then why did they invade?

it was the element of surprise in reverse...or something

I heard hillary out lecturing on all things russia...good grief

Yup if one goes, we all go, I’m hoping Putin isn’t off his kgb nut.
I don't think a single nuke in Ukraine would automatically lead to all out nuclear war. One talking head today said that Putin wants to be regarded as one of the great Russian leaders, if everyone is dead there will be nobody to remember him.

In that event which is certainly possible I could totally see China stepping in to diffuse the situation with big territorial concessions as the price.

So Putin’s already sent Thermobarics into Kharkiv, probably into Kyiv tonight
Why would anyone think that he will not do that he has done in Aleppo, Chechnya and Grosyna.
If you think he’ll stop there, you’re not a history student.
There will be another former part of the Soviet empire that is next to fall into line.
So we can wait or step up now.
The difference might be a year, good luck with waiting
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

So if it's clear that Russia isn't ready, then why did they invade?

John Bolton : “The fact is that [Trump] barely knew where Ukraine was. He once asked John Kelly, his second chief of staff, if Finland were a part of Russia. It’s just not accurate to say that Trump's behavior somehow deterred the Russians.”
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

John Bolton : “The fact is that [Trump] barely knew where Ukraine was. He once asked John Kelly, his second chief of staff, if Finland were a part of Russia. It’s just not accurate to say that Trump's behavior somehow deterred the Russians.”
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Not everything Bolton has said is agreed by many to be "The fact." And "barely" knowing is not a factual description of either knowledge or ignorance. It's a rhetorical trick to falsely impute ignorance. Nor does Bolton tell us the context of Trump asking the question about Finland. Trump very often is being sarcastic. And saying that it's "not accurate" to say something is a weaselly way of trying to imply that it's not true.

In any event, whether Trump "barely" knew where Ukraine was or if he was not certain if Finland was a part of Russia (which it once was part of the Russian empire), or not, do not mean that he had no impact on deterring Putin.

Of course, you do like to resort to "close enough" (not really) insinuations.

So Putin’s already sent Thermobarics into Kharkiv, probably into Kyiv tonight
Why would anyone think that he will not do that he has done in Aleppo, Chechnya and Grosyna.
If you think he’ll stop there, you’re not a history student.
There will be another former part of the Soviet empire that is next to fall into line.
So we can wait or step up now.
The difference might be a year, good luck with waiting
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

didn't biden say "give it a month"?

Kamala explains things.....soooo...Ukraine is a country....next to another country...that is a bigger country

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HuDsUV44h10

So if it's clear that Russia isn't ready, then why did they invade?

Because his army was told to invade by Putin . You seem to think his generals have a lot of input and people stood up to Putin and said FYI boss were not ready. And he. Said okay
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I bet good spelling and coherent sentence structure is important when conveying military orders and communications....:nopain:

So if it's clear that Russia isn't ready, then why did they invade?

Because Vladi told all his Generals and Leadership they would be greeted as liberators then his Generals and Leadership told Vladi they would be greeted as liberators and he believed them.

Greeted as liberators - heard that one before.


A lot of things don't make sense though. Are Russians really this bad? Such bad logistics? Keep in mind our logistics jumped through hoops to support tens of thousands of troops / units 10,000 miles away and across oceans yet Russia can't supply logistics to a country on it's border? An army moves on its stomach, right?

Why would Russia have lots of moves made by Territorial Guard Troops instead of their first line?

Why would Russia be handling comms with Baofengs you can get off Amazon?

A lot of things don't make sense though.



^^^this...

I bet good spelling and coherent sentence structure is important when conveying military orders and communications....:nopain:

A serious thread about a serious situation with global impact, leave it to you to do what you do best, petty juvenile posts are your MO.

A serious thread about a serious situation with global impact, leave it to you to do what you do best, petty juvenile posts are your MO.

from the internet tough guy who thinks he's solving the world's problems on a website...

wait....aren't you the guy who only pops into this worthless place mock the stupidity of others for a few laughs? :biglaugh:

Conscripts. School teachers, janitors, mechanics, everyday joes received a call to report for 3-5 day "training". Then clothed and loaded up in transports having no idea where they are going. Thrown to front line as fodder as artillery work from behind. Russian gameplan has not changed since ancient times. Soften them up with numbers of foot soldiers they are willing to literally sacrifice.
Hopefully, social media will be utilized to reach out to these non-soldiers wearing Russian uniforms, and along with the general population, give rise to a significant surrender and problem for Putin. Despite his best efforts, he can't shut down all lines of communication within his own people. This alone may end up being a major contributor to the outcome.

Because Vladi told all his Generals and Leadership they would be greeted as liberators then his Generals and Leadership told Vladi they would be greeted as liberators and he believed them.

Greeted as liberators - heard that one before.


A lot of things don't make sense though. Are Russians really this bad? Such bad logistics? Keep in mind our logistics jumped through hoops to support tens of thousands of troops / units 10,000 miles away and across oceans yet Russia can't supply logistics to a country on it's border? An army moves on its stomach, right?



The average Russian has no problems with Ukr. and in many cases are fighting their cousins/friends. Their hearts are not in it. Plus the Russians are prob. poorly equiped, poorly trained, treated badly, etc.

I think there is zero chance they invade Poland bc of NATO.

I think there is zero chance they invade Poland bc of NATO.



depends on what his goal is and no one seems to know what that is....although I think he's hinted in the past

I think there is zero chance they invade Poland bc of NATO.

unless he’s lost his mind.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Russian police jail kids who took flowers and 'No to War' signs to Ukraine's embassy
ages 7-11 with their Moms thats was cowardice looks like

Russian police jail kids who took flowers and 'No to War' signs to Ukraine's embassy
ages 7-11 with their Moms thats was cowardice looks like

probably wouldn't get away with that in China either...

probably wouldn't get away with that in China either...

Or Alabama, Arkansas (two different statutes), Florida, Iowa, Missouri, North Dakota (three different statutes), Oklahoma (two different statutes), South Dakota (three different statutes), Tennessee (three different statutes), Texas, Utah and West Virginia.

Or Alabama, Arkansas (two different statutes), Florida, Iowa, Missouri, North Dakota (three different statutes), Oklahoma (two different statutes), South Dakota (three different statutes), Tennessee (three different statutes), Texas, Utah and West Virginia.

statutes for arresting 7 year olds with flowers?

Or Alabama, Arkansas (two different statutes), Florida, Iowa, Missouri, North Dakota (three different statutes), Oklahoma (two different statutes), South Dakota (three different statutes), Tennessee (three different statutes), Texas, Utah and West Virginia.


I am astounded you would correlate any limits on freedom as you mention above with Russia.




If you blow / topple statues and light fires wearing a BLM shirt, you're probably fine.

my brother built a 3,000 sf colonial
in Franklin TN ( Nashville suburb) ten years ago.

Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

have they arrested his wife and kids yet?

Personal attacks not cool here.... Please stay on subject

Personal attacks not cool here.... Please stay on subject

Impossible

They would have to step out of character and that’s not happening.

Personal attacks not cool here.... Please stay on subject

we need a statute :hihi:

have they arrested his wife and kids yet?

TN is like china and russia.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

They would have to step out of character and that’s not happening.

you’re in the “they”, hate to tell you. you do it too.

there’s more to civility than expecting it from others. you have to show it too.

really something, for you and paul to complain about.


Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Impossible

remember the screen shot TDF took of some of your recent posts?

lead by example.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

have they arrested his wife and kids yet?

i built a similar colonial in CT, in a popular hartford suburb, probably worth 35% more than i paid. his house almost tripled. And my property taxes are triple what his are, and of course we have a state income tax. but TN offers no freedom.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

i built a similar colonial in CT, in a popular hartford suburb, probably worth 35% more than i paid. his house almost tripled. And my property taxes are triple what his are, and of course we have a state income tax. but TN offers no freedom.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I heard those Tennessee Gulags are some pretty rough places
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

you’re in the “they”, hate to tell you. you do it too.


Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

racist, traitor etc....=OK....ignoramus=beyond the pale :love:

I heard those Tennessee Gulags are some pretty rough places
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

friend/customer of mine just bought a gulag near Nashville, loves it there

I heard those Tennessee Gulags are some pretty rough places
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

i’ve visited him twice, and i wouldn’t want to live there, but it’s one of the fastest growing regions of the country. at one point 100 people a day were moving to the nashville suburbs.

it’s not because americans want to be imprisoned.

it’s not on the water, doesn’t have great mountains or skiing. but it offers a great quality of life at a fraction of the cost of living in new england. and the state leaves you pretty much alone..

very different from CT.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

remember the screen shot TDF took of some of your recent posts?

lead by example.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

They were ALL in response to your insults. Did you not remember that?

Why should anyone take your constant insults?

you’re in the “they”, hate to tell you. you do it too.

there’s more to civility than expecting it from others. you have to show it too.

really something, for you and paul to complain about.


Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Again, why should anyone here take your constant insults and not respond?

very different from CT.

Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

yeah I still like Florida...should be plenty of room there now that deathsantis has killed everyone...my oldest is going to grad school in southeast fla, taking her down in May, might not come back:btu:

yeah I still like Florida...should be plenty of room there now that deathsantis has killed everyone...my oldest is going to grad school in southeast fla, taking her down in May, might not come back:btu:

i hear Florida is a post apocalyptic wasteland thanks to Deathsantis ( ha ha ha makes me laugh every time) and Gov Cuomo is “the gold standard” according to Biden, he was so awesome the Hollywood invented an award to give him.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I heard those Tennessee Gulags are some pretty rough places
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

It's my understanding that when China had decided to build slave labor camps to put the Uyghurs in, they modeled those camps based on the concentration camps in TN.

They were ALL in response to your insults. Did you not remember that?

Why should anyone take your constant insults?

And similarly (not justified though), I also only throw elbows after being elbowed.

So did I mess the announcement that only you have the right to hit back? I'm very sorry if I missed that.

And let me remind you all, the subject is Ukraine........

1/3rd of Taiwan mysteriously lost power...that's weird

I am astounded you would correlate any limits on freedom as you mention above with Russia.




If you blow / topple statues and light fires wearing a BLM shirt, you're probably fine.

Just a friendly FYI

I didn't pass these anti protest Laws those states did ... and we know why those laws were passed and (your BLM reference says it all) it's a slippery slope and it all starts somewhere..

But Truckers blocking roadways is supported by the same party who passed these .. funny how that works :btu:

And similarly (not justified though), I also only throw elbows after being elbowed.I'd disagree with that.

So did I mess the announcement that only you have the right to hit back? I'm very sorry if I missed that.

Of course you do but in my experience you start it.

Of course you do but in my experience you start it.

in my experience you never see, or never care about, what those on your side do.

try paying closer attention.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

in my experience you never see, or never care about, what those on your side do.So when you insult me bc you think someone else insulted you that is ok? :rotflmao:

try paying closer attention.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

See you can't help yourself.

Wonder if this is the reason the convoy is stalled - cheap Chinese tires:

Trent Telenko, a retired Pentagon staff specialist and military history blogger, suggests another big reason may be Russia's tires, as he explained in a long, illustrated Twitter thread based on photos of deserted Russian Pantsir-S1 wheeled gun-missile systems and his own experience as a U.S. Army vehicle auditor. "When you leave military truck tires in one place for months on end," the sidewalls get brittle in the sun and fail like the tires on the Pantsir-SR, he wrote. "No one exercised that vehicle for one year."

Karl Muth, an economist, government adviser, and self-described "tire expert," jumped in, agreeing with Telenko but adding some details about the tires.

"There is a huge operational level implication in this," Telenko said. "If the Russian Army was too corrupt to exercise a Pantsir-S1, they were too corrupt to exercise the trucks and wheeled [armored fighting vehicles] now in Ukraine," meaning "the Russians simply cannot risk them off-road during the Rasputitsa/mud season." That is a problem for the convoy in the north, he added. "The Crimea is a desert and the South Ukrainian coastal areas are dryer. So we are not seeing this there. But elsewhere the Russians have a huge problem for the next 4 to 6 weeks." Read Telenko's whole thread on Twitter.

See you can't help yourself.

i’ve asked you point blank about some comments from lefties, you responded point blank that you didn’t care. you only care when others engage in it.

selective outrage, is fake outrage.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Wonder if this is the reason the convoy is stalled - cheap Chinese tires:

Trent Telenko, a retired Pentagon staff specialist and military history blogger, suggests another big reason may be Russia's tires, as he explained in a long, illustrated Twitter thread based on photos of deserted Russian Pantsir-S1 wheeled gun-missile systems and his own experience as a U.S. Army vehicle auditor. "When you leave military truck tires in one place for months on end," the sidewalls get brittle in the sun and fail like the tires on the Pantsir-SR, he wrote. "No one exercised that vehicle for one year."

Karl Muth, an economist, government adviser, and self-described "tire expert," jumped in, agreeing with Telenko but adding some details about the tires.

"There is a huge operational level implication in this," Telenko said. "If the Russian Army was too corrupt to exercise a Pantsir-S1, they were too corrupt to exercise the trucks and wheeled [armored fighting vehicles] now in Ukraine," meaning "the Russians simply cannot risk them off-road during the Rasputitsa/mud season." That is a problem for the convoy in the north, he added. "The Crimea is a desert and the South Ukrainian coastal areas are dryer. So we are not seeing this there. But elsewhere the Russians have a huge problem for the next 4 to 6 weeks." Read Telenko's whole thread on Twitter.

It certainly appears the Russians have a big problem or multiple problems, it’s to bad they haven’t got the drones to take out the forward areas of that convoy and create a major bottleneck. Hopefully we have some covert supply operations ongoing to get those weapons to the front.

i’ve asked you point blank about some comments from lefties, you responded point blank that you didn’t care. you only care when others engage in it.

selective outrage, is fake outrage.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Hilarious.

That is right. Why should I care what others do? You insult me, I'll insult you back. Just bc you can't control yourself and bc you get in a pissing contest w/someone else you think it's appropriate to insult anyone else shows what type of person you are.

It certainly appears the Russians have a big problem or multiple problems,

these things don't typically go smoothly....

You insult me, I'll insult you back.



you two are adorable....

these things don't typically go smoothly....

no, hopefully it continues to be a big disappointment.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

1/3rd of Taiwan mysteriously lost power...that's weird


Saw that. Rumored to be a failure at one station cascading to others.


Just a friendly FYI

I didn't pass these anti protest Laws those states did ... and we know why those laws were passed and (your BLM reference says it all) it's a slippery slope and it all starts somewhere..

But Truckers blocking roadways is supported by the same party who passed these .. funny how that works :btu:

Your slippery slope is not OK but yours is. Got it. Or is it both sides?

Wonder if this is the reason the convoy is stalled - cheap Chinese tires:

Trent Telenko, a retired Pentagon staff specialist and military history blogger, suggests another big reason may be Russia's tires, as he explained in a long, illustrated Twitter thread based on photos of deserted Russian Pantsir-S1 wheeled gun-missile systems and his own experience as a U.S. Army vehicle auditor. "When you leave military truck tires in one place for months on end," the sidewalls get brittle in the sun and fail like the tires on the Pantsir-SR, he wrote. "No one exercised that vehicle for one year."

Karl Muth, an economist, government adviser, and self-described "tire expert," jumped in, agreeing with Telenko but adding some details about the tires.

"There is a huge operational level implication in this," Telenko said. "If the Russian Army was too corrupt to exercise a Pantsir-S1, they were too corrupt to exercise the trucks and wheeled [armored fighting vehicles] now in Ukraine," meaning "the Russians simply cannot risk them off-road during the Rasputitsa/mud season." That is a problem for the convoy in the north, he added. "The Crimea is a desert and the South Ukrainian coastal areas are dryer. So we are not seeing this there. But elsewhere the Russians have a huge problem for the next 4 to 6 weeks." Read Telenko's whole thread on Twitter.


It was a fascinating read, that the Cheap Chinese knock off tires of the expensive Michellins are of subpar manufacture and simply breaking in the mud.

It was a fascinating read, that the Cheap Chinese knock off tires of the expensive Michellins are of subpar manufacture and simply breaking in the mud.
And MRE's five years past their expiration date. We need a gofundme to help these kids.

So, nuclear weapons are the big threat.

KYIV, Ukraine (AP) — Plant spokesman says Russian troops have begun shelling Europe's largest nuclear power station in Ukraine.
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Battle is going right now on the power station grounds.

But, because there might be nuclear war if we do something, we hesitate and let Putin destroy any semblance of rational policy because if we did he might kill us sooner rather than later.
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Battle is going right now on the power station grounds.

Yep they’re going after the power infrastructure. Not to stop military production . But punish the population and their defiance
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Battle is going right now on the power station grounds.

what could go wrong there?
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Could it be that John Mearsheimer in the video that Scott posted earlier in this thread is right? Putin simply wants to wreck what's left of Ukraine rather than occupying it or incorporating it into Russia in a sort of new Soviet Union?

But, because there might be nuclear war if we do something, we hesitate and let Putin destroy any semblance of rational policy because if we did he might kill us sooner rather than later.
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Yes, Pete. There will probably be nuclear war, at some level, if NATO intervenes. Probably not a small one.



Yep they’re going after the power infrastructure. Not to stop military production . But punish the population and their defiance
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They are wrecking everything. Punitive invasion then occupation.

that video with biden telling us how putin doesn't want ole' joe to be president because putin is scared of ole' toe to toe joe...isn't aging well...

Yes, Pete. There will probably be nuclear war, at some level, if NATO intervenes. Probably not a small one.


History repeats
There was a great interview with Fiona Hill in Politico

The more we talk, the more we’re using World War II analogies. There are people who are saying we’re on the brink of a World War III.

Hill: We’re already in it. We have been for some time. We keep thinking of World War I, World War II as these huge great big set pieces, but World War II was a consequence of World War I. And we had an interwar period between them. And in a way, we had that again after the Cold War. Many of the things that we’re talking about here have their roots in the carving up of the Austro-Hungarian Empire and the Russian Empire at the end of World War I. At the end of World War II, we had another reconfiguration and some of the issues that we have been dealing with recently go back to that immediate post-war period. We’ve had war in Syria, which is in part the consequence of the collapse of the Ottoman Empire, same with Iraq and Kuwait.

All of the conflicts that we’re seeing have roots in those earlier conflicts. We are already in a hot war over Ukraine, which started in 2014. People shouldn’t delude themselves into thinking that we’re just on the brink of something. We’ve been well and truly in it for quite a long period of time.

But this is also a full-spectrum information war, and what happens in a Russian “all-of-society” war, you soften up the enemy. You get the Tucker Carlsons and Donald Trumps doing your job for you. The fact that Putin managed to persuade Trump that Ukraine belongs to Russia, and that Trump would be willing to give up Ukraine without any kind of fight, that’s a major success for Putin’s information war. I mean he has got swathes of the Republican Party — and not just them, some on the left, as well as on the right — masses of the U.S. public saying, “Good on you, Vladimir Putin,” or blaming NATO, or blaming the U.S. for this outcome. This is exactly what a Russian information war and psychological operation is geared towards. He’s been carefully seeding this terrain as well. We’ve been at war, for a very long time. I’ve been saying this for years.
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Here will be the next Russian weapon against Ukraine and blaming 🇺🇸

“Giant red flag here. The risk of CW use is real. “Offering no evidence, Lavrov said Russia had information that the United States was worried about the prospect of losing control over what he described as chemical & biological laboratories in Ukraine”
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-60532634

Russian helicopter shot down. Looks like a stinger

I bet the Russians flew the same route daily or frequent enough and gave them and perfect set up. To shoot

Surprised there was a single bird. and they weren’t flying in pairs ?

Saw the same thing in Iraq with IED attacks , there was usually a cameraman man in the area for an attack
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Ukraine has definitely been punching up.

Waiting for photos but hearing UA Marines took out 2 dozen helicopters at a captured base outside Kherson.

GoogleEarth shows the base had 40 helicopters from before the latest invasion so could mean a lot of different things.

Seem Putin's next phase is Push refugees west and cause a humanity crisis in Nato Countries similar to the exodus from Syria . in Hope the Local Nationalist population in these countries will create turmoil

I just read an article that said that a Russian spokesman said that they would stop shelling and cease operations if Ukraine recognized crimea and the other 2 break away regions as independent states and if Ukraine re wrote their constitution to create a neutral country. Seems logical to me and I hope this #^&#^&#^&#^& ends soon.


https://www.reuters.com/world/kremlin-says-russian-military-action-will-stop-moment-if-ukraine-meets-2022-03-07/

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I just read an article that said that a Russian spokesman said that they would stop shelling and cease operations if Ukraine recognized crimea and the other 2 break away regions as independent states and if Ukraine re wrote their constitution to create a neutral country. Seems logical to me and I hope this #^&#^&#^&#^& ends soon.


https://www.reuters.com/world/kremlin-says-russian-military-action-will-stop-moment-if-ukraine-meets-2022-03-07/

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Putin wants to upend world order. This wouldn't serve that goal. I'm a lot more pessimistic than I was 6 days ago. At least we've learned the Russians can't fight a conventional war.

Putang wanted to upend world order. Then he realized that the world would cancel everything Russian.
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Putin wants to upend world order. This wouldn't serve that goal. I'm a lot more pessimistic than I was 6 days ago. At least we've learned the Russians can't fight a conventional war.

I read numerous articles calling the Russian army a potamkin army. Putin has shattered the myth of Russian army strength.
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I read numerous articles calling the Russian army a potamkin army. Putin has shattered the myth of Russian army strength.
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Which unfortunately makes him even scarier, if his only big stick now is his nuclear arsenal.

^^^ some impressive insight.....:hihi: kamala level genius

A senior Russian military commander has been killed in a battle on the edge of the eastern Ukrainian city of Kharkiv, Ukraine's defence ministry says.
Maj-Gen Vitaly Gerasimov, 41st Army chief of staff, died along with other Russian officers, the report says.

It’s seems the Russians only have pockets of control , if the Ukraine troops move in and out of areas killing Generals

And I don’t think the Russian army has an NCO Corp and with out them when you just have officers who know the operation objectives . when they die or get removed from the battle no one knows what to do next

And we might be see this working in real time
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temps expected to drop to 20 below. Will make it tough for people trying to escape. it will make it easier for things that now are getting stuck in the mud but hopefully make it more miserable for the Russian soldiers sitting around in their vehicles.

I just read an article that said that a Russian spokesman said that they would stop shelling and cease operations if Ukraine recognized crimea and the other 2 break away regions as independent states and if Ukraine re wrote their constitution to create a neutral country. Seems logical to me and I hope this #^&#^&#^&#^& ends soon.


https://www.reuters.com/world/kremlin-says-russian-military-action-will-stop-moment-if-ukraine-meets-2022-03-07/

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Logical?

Which unfortunately makes him even scarier, if his only big stick now is his nuclear arsenal.


Yep.

Best we just keep doing what we are doing, filtered ISR, providing weapons support. Extra support NATO countries bordering Ukraine.

Logical?




Yep.

Best we just keep doing what we are doing, filtered ISR, providing weapons support. Extra support NATO countries bordering Ukraine.

i wonder how much of a provocation it is, if we send aircraft to
ukraine via poland.
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I just read an article that said that a Russian spokesman said that they would stop shelling and cease operations if Ukraine recognized crimea and the other 2 break away regions as independent states and if Ukraine re wrote their constitution to create a neutral country. Seems logical to me and I hope this #^&#^&#^&#^& ends soon.


https://www.reuters.com/world/kremlin-says-russian-military-action-will-stop-moment-if-ukraine-meets-2022-03-07/

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Respectfully, what is logical? Are you kidding me? He (Putin) should get zero conditions.... from UKR or the world at large. He will be getting the conditions, eventually, unless he gets taken out first.

i wonder how much of a provocation it is, if we send aircraft to
ukraine via poland.
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Very provacative. If UKR pilots picked up Mig 29s from Poland, flew them unarmed to a base / highway strip in UA and then loaded up and flew missions from UA territory - much safer than flying FROM Poland.



Respectfully, what is logical? Are you kidding me? He (Putin) should get zero conditions.... from UKR or the world at large. He will be getting the conditions, eventually, unless he gets taken out first.




Hoping for the latter, to think Ukraine should roll over for Putin is fvcking nuts - especially now. Don't know what Eben was smoking but I guess he would be OK with Russia taking control of parts of the US - for peace.

Very provacative. If UKR pilots picked up Mig 29s from Poland, flew them unarmed to a base / highway strip in UA and then loaded up and flew missions from UA territory - much safer than flying FROM Poland.

Agreed, that is a smart plan.


Don't know what Eben was smoking but I guess he would be OK with Russia taking control of parts of the US - for peace.
Only Jim's house and maybe Scott's. :hee:
Red Dawn v. 2.0

Respectfully, what is logical? Are you kidding me? He (Putin) should get zero conditions.... from UKR or the world at large. He will be getting the conditions, eventually, unless he gets taken out first.

I said logical because those regions want to separate from Ukraine anyway. Let them !!! Not only would this solve the current conflict but also the fighting that has been happening for years.
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Red Dawn v. 2.0

I was very disappointed when I read an article earlier today that was discussing a poll that only like 70% of Americans would stay and fight if we were invaded.
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I was very disappointed when I read an article earlier today that was discussing a poll that only like 70% of Americans would stay and fight if we were invaded.
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I’m already seeing “WOLVERINES!” Tee shirts in my Facebook feed.

I was very disappointed when I read an article earlier today that was discussing a poll that only like 70% of Americans would stay and fight if we were invaded.
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it would be pretty funny if suddenly Americans were flooding across the border into Mexico....

poll that only like 70% of Americans would stay and fight if we were invaded.

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I wonder who thinks their country isn't worth defending and why?

That other 30% are probably gender fluid, live in their parent's basements, and spent four years furiously typing "Not my President" on their $800 iPhone.
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That other 30% are probably gender fluid, live in their parent's basements, and spent four years furiously typing "Not my President" on their $800 iPhone and decrying capitalism.
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fixed it :laugha:...

and I wonder how many would "actually" stay and fight....I suspect the "I might not agree with what you say but I'll defend to the death your right to say it" frauds would turn tail pretty quickly

That other 30% are probably gender fluid, live in their parent's basements, and spent four years furiously typing "Not my President" on their $800 iPhone.
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i think about this a lot in terms of the greatest generation. huge numbers fought for the US, in greater numbers than any generation subsequent to them ever could.

Fascinating to me, is that they all grew up in the Great Depression, you’d think they’d be the ones who felt like they didn’t owe their country anything. But despite living in miserable hopeless poverty, they were fiercely patriotic.

Maybe they NEEDED the experience of growing up in the depression, to prepare them for the horrors that awaited them. As we have seen for sure, prosperity can lead to softness. Fascinating stuff.
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What’s even funnier people praising those who say they would fight and making fun of The Who say they won’t
these brave New Patriots will to fight if in the remote chance the US is invaded

Never served in any branch of service lol. FYI Only 10% of Americans have ever served ..
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What’s even funnier people praising those who say they would fight and making fun of The Who say they won’t
these brave New Patriots will to fight if in the remote chance the US is invaded

Never served in any branch of service lol. FYI Only 10% of Americans have ever served ..
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is there a point here?

I said logical because those regions want to separate from Ukraine anyway. Let them !!! Not only would this solve the current conflict but also the fighting that has been happening for years.
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Much less of those people in those provinces after RU pulled 2014. Even less now. A lot of Russian speaking Ukrainians are fighting against Russia.


I was very disappointed when I read an article earlier today that was discussing a poll that only like 70% of Americans would stay and fight if we were invaded.
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My boss would be of the 30%, he would not fight to save his family.

Wanted: multilingual former soldiers willing to covertly head into Ukraine for the handsome sum of up to $2,000 (£1,523) per day - plus bonus - to help rescue families from an increasingly grim conflict.

I think they mean Rescuing rich Ukraine Families

is there a point here?

Yep.

I’m already seeing “WOLVERINES!” Tee shirts in my Facebook feed.

I am seeing them also

virtue signaling is a national past time....

My boss would be of the 30%, he would not fight to save his family.

Unfort. In actual combat I might make a decent human shield.

Russian claims of biowarfare labs in Ukraine

And Tucker Carlson is promoting Russian lies on his show shocking

And using China talking points

And using Tulsi gabbard to suggest it’s just like covid funding labs for secret experiments..

And no one knew before the invasion Lol


biological research - scientific research conducted by biologists. cloning - a general term for the research activity that creates a copy of some biological entity (a gene or organism or cell)



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Yet another sighting of Tucker Carlson on Russia's state TV. This time, he was arguing against banning Russian oil. TuckyoRose is sticking up for Putin's interests and state TV propagandists are eating it up.

Great job by the “CONservatives”
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Russia might not be able to occupy, but if they keep capturing and shutting down nuclear power stations, they will turn a lot of Ukraine into a nuclear wasteland.

Reports this morning that they bombed a Children's Hospital, crazy.
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If this war criminal didn’t have nuclear weapons, this war probably never would happen or if it started, nato could have stepped in to stop it in its tracks. I hope Putin and his generals eventually pay the price for these war crimes.

If this war criminal didn’t have nuclear weapons, this war probably never would happen or if it started, nato could have stepped in to stop it in its tracks. I hope Putin and his generals eventually pay the price for these war crimes.

exactly correct. having them, and being perceived as someone who wouldnt lose a moments sleep
over using them. Biden is in an almost impossible situation for any president.
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Biden is in an almost impossible situation for any president.

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other presidents have dealt with hostile powers with nuclear weapons...

Remember all of the people who admired Putin because he said he believed in 'traditional family values'?
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Remember all of the people who admired Putin because he said he believed in 'traditional family values'?
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actually no, but I remember a guy who said putin is afraid of biden?

actually no, but I remember a guy who said putin is afraid of biden?

I remember a guy who thought that Russia is entitled to part of Ukraine
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Remember all of the people who admired Putin because he said he believed in 'traditional family values'?
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who said that?
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I remember a guy who thought that Russia is entitled to part of Ukraine
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so can we agree that he idiots who said both of those things, neither is fit to be potus?
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who said that?
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Buchanan, Trump, Graham, Carlson, Bannon
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so can we agree that he idiots who said both of those things, neither is fit to be potus?
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No
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Remember all of the people who admired Putin because he said he believed in 'traditional family values'?
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Said no one ever.... Source?

Vladimir Putin's 'strength' has been praised here for years
Many members of the American right, emboldened by Trump, are on a rampage against those who don't look or act just like them, or conform to their notion of "traditional" or conservative values. White nationalists admire Putin for enforcing uniformity and not tolerating factionalism. They resent groups of minority Americans — African-American, Latinx, gay or transgender people, among others — for expressing pride in their respective identities.

Take it from conservative Fox News anchor Tucker Carlson, who declared Feb. 22 that Americans who reject Putin should ask themselves, "Has Putin ever called me a racist? Has he threatened to get me fired for disagreeing with him?”

https://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/opinion/columnists/rekha-basu/2022/03/05/putin-russia-ukraine-invasion-american-right-wing-donald-trump-support/9321992002/

Russia’s new media landscape: VPN demand grew by 1,092%,

Seems russians want different sources of Information without the prying eyes the state


Russian media regulator Roskomnadzor also moved against foreign social media networks, and Russia banned news reports that aren’t favorable to its military.

Russia’s new media landscape: VPN demand grew by 1,092%,

Seems russians want different sources of Information without the prying eyes the state

Yeah, that had nothing to do with the pandemic and people shifting to telework scenarios.

https://www.statista.com/topics/6548/remote-work-in-russia/

"Remote work, also known as telework or telecommuting, became increasingly relevant in Russia during the COVID-19 pandemic. During the lockdown in the spring of 2020, most companies were required to transfer employees to remote work. One of the trend's consequences was a wider usage of cloud services, the corporate internet, and tools to facilitate communication between employees, such as group calls or messaging. In general, the possibility to work remotely was seen as convenient by Russians, and 40 percent named it one of the most important criteria while searching for a job in 2021."


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Yeah, that had nothing to do with the pandemic and people shifting to telework scenarios.

https://www.statista.com/topics/6548/remote-work-in-russia/

"Remote work, also known as telework or telecommuting, became increasingly relevant in Russia during the COVID-19 pandemic. During the lockdown in the spring of 2020, most companies were required to transfer employees to remote work. One of the trend's consequences was a wider usage of cloud services, the corporate internet, and tools to facilitate communication between employees, such as group calls or messaging. In general, the possibility to work remotely was seen as convenient by Russians, and 40 percent named it one of the most important criteria while searching for a job in 2021."


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Who said anything about the pandemic caused it?


Russians turn to VPNs to stay connected as online censorship tightens over Ukraine war

https://www.euronews.com/next/2022/03/09/russians-turn-to-vpns-to-stay-connected-as-online-censorship-tightens-over-ukraine-war
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Russian Embassy’s Posts Calling An Apparent Pregnant Ukraine Hospital Victim A Crisis Actor

Alex Jones must be advising the Russians
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Said no one ever.... Source?
Try Franklin Graham

Calling Vladimir Putin’s presence at the Olympics “commanding,” Graham chastised President Barack Obama and lauded the Russian president. “Isn’t it sad,” Graham wrote, “that America’s own morality has fallen so far that on this issue—protecting children from any homosexual agenda or propaganda—Russia’s standard is higher than our own?” As a bonus, Graham added, Putin was supporting the Assad regime in Syria in order to protect persecuted Christians. “In my opinion, Putin is right on these issues,” he wrote.

Say what you like about Vladimir Putin; he may be slaughtering innocent Ukrainians, but, on the plus side, he has never once called the Fox News anchor Tucker Carlson a racist. Last Tuesday, Carlson, who is reportedly paid $10m (£7.5m) a year for his piercing insights and analysis, told Americans that they had been brainwashed into thinking Putin was a baddie. Think critically, Carlson instructed his depressingly large audience. Ask yourself this, he posited: “Has Putin ever called me a racist? Has he threatened to get me fired for disagreeing with him? … Is he making fentanyl? Is he trying to snuff out Christianity? Does he eat dogs? These are fair questions – and the answer to all of them is no.” To be clear: these are inane questions and the answer to all of them is: “Turn off Fox News before the rest of your brain turns to mush.”
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Who said anything about the pandemic caused it?
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I did
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I did
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So your comment had nothing to do with VPN’s increasing in Russia after they invaded Ukraine aka recently

thanks for the info from Aug 11 2021
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No, my comment had to do with VPN’s increasing in Russia due to the changing telework requirements caused by the Pandemic. Which explains why the huge increase in VPN’s. I also provided a link that supported my claim.

I know I could have just posted it in the format that you use for your usual gibberish and innuendo, with the BS flag emoji and finished it off with “Shocking” to seal the deal. But I tried a different approach :rolleyes:
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No, my comment had to do with VPN’s increasing in Russia due to the changing telework requirements caused by the Pandemic. Which explains why the huge increase in VPN’s. I also provided a link that supported my claim.

I know I could have just posted it in the format that you use for your usual gibberish and innuendo, with the BS flag emoji and finished it off with “Shocking” to seal the deal. But I tried a different approach :rolleyes:
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Like I said your response is irrelevant to to what I posted

The 1000% increase I referred to .
Was since the invasion

Where is that incorrect?

I am sure they (vpns) during the. Pandemic, increase but for different reasons not as a result of Russia invasion and increased sate restrictions on content
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Said no one ever.... Source?
I saw this looking for sources also. seems Putin’s make over has been happening slowly overtime to a point where many Republicans will call Democrats communist and socialist!
Then praise Putin or use him to criticize their ownPOTUS for political points

https://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/commentary/2017/03/07/why-republicans-like-putin/

That's why Republican culture-warrior Pat Buchanan declared Putin "one of us" in 2013, when Putin instituted new prohibitions on "propaganda" by homosexuals. "While his stance as a defender of traditional values has drawn the mockery of Western media and cultural elites, Putin is not wrong in saying that he can speak for much of mankind," Buchanan wrote.
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Rep. Madison Cawthorn (R-N.C.) recently called Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky a “thug” and said the Ukrainian government is “incredibly evil,”

Seems he is still upset Ukraine didn’t give Trump the Dirt he wanted?

What else could it Be. Unless he actually thinks Putins de nazifying Ukraine
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Rep. Madison Cawthorn (R-N.C.) recently called Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky a “thug” and said the Ukrainian government is “incredibly evil,”

Seems he is still upset Ukraine didn’t give Trump the Dirt he wanted?

What else could it Be. Unless he actually thinks Putins de nazifying Ukraine
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Wayne, when you (1) ignore every bad thing your side does, and (2) ignore every good thing the right does, that must make you feel very very content. But is it an accurate way to evaluate things?

Cawthorn is an extremist to be sure.

Democratic Rep Hank Johnson said he was concerned about building a military base on Guam, because the island could tip over. What's your comment on that?

Maxine Waters said Americans should hound those in Trumps cabinet to let them know they aren't welcome anywhere, anytime. Any comment?

Pete Buttigieg (who will likely be a presidential contender in 2024), says that for Americans struggling to pay $4.50 gallon at the pump, the answer is to buy an electric car.

Here's the reality, Wayne. There are a huge number of democrats, there are a huge number of Republicans. There are good and bad people on both sides, there are good and bad ideas on both sides. Among the strong lefties here, not a single one of you can concede that simple, and obvious, truth.

Anything to avoid discussing the multiple disasters and crises and failures of this administration.

Cawthorn is a huge disappointment, a kook.

Cawthorn is a huge disappointment, a kook.

You could have started and finished with that.

Again get back to me when those people you mentioned try to overturn the election or promote civil war like 4 wheels has
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Deutsche Bank just doubled down on its decision to continue doing business in Russia despite Russia's invasion of Ukraine

DB was also the only bank that would lend to an obvious fraud, Donald Trump, and is notorious for Russian money laundering

Anyone at all surprised?

iran is apparently scared of brandon too....china must be terrified

Mitt Romney: “Tulsi Gabbard is parroting false Russian propaganda. Her treasonous lies may well cost lives.”
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Mitt Romney: “Tulsi Gabbard is parroting false Russian propaganda. Her treasonous lies may well cost lives.”
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they should arrest her for treason....

Mitt Romney: “Tulsi Gabbard is parroting false Russian propaganda. Her treasonous lies may well cost lives.”
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Like is pointed out she was on Tucker Carlson show spewing the same thing
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Like is pointed out she was on Tucker Carlson show spewing the same thing
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they should both be arrested....

The New York Times
Russian Invasion Could Spur Covid Surge in Ukraine, Doctors Say



oh good,,,brandon can send them Made in China masks and test kits

wdmso, how do you interpret the fact that saudi arabia and the UAE refused to take phone calls from Biden? I thought Biden was going to be the one that got the world to stand behind us again?

Let me guess. they were too intimidated by his vast intellect, so they’re avoiding him? Is that what it is?
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Deutsche Bank just doubled down on its decision to continue doing business in Russia despite Russia's invasion of Ukraine

DB was also the only bank that would lend to an obvious fraud, Donald Trump, and is notorious for Russian money laundering

Anyone at all surprised?

Citibank still operating in Russia.... Right up there with Bank of America as top two banks screwing American public.

wdmso, how do you interpret the fact that saudi arabia and the UAE refused to take phone calls from Biden? I thought Biden was going to be the one that got the world to stand behind us again?

Let me guess. they were too intimidated by his vast intellect, so they’re avoiding him? Is that what it is?
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Once again you chase the laser pointer

The world is with America

Saudi and the UAE. The size of Maine do not represent the world


Persian Gulf monarchies have signaled they won’t help ease surging oil prices unless Washington supports them in Yemen or grant the Saudi king immunity for killing
Khashoggi


The White House unsuccessfully tried to arrange calls between President Biden and the de facto leaders of Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates as the U.S. was working to build international support for Ukraine and contain a surge in oil prices, said Middle East and U.S. officials.

So Biden spoke to him a few weeks ago , https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2022/02/09/readout-of-president-joseph-r-biden-jr-s-call-with-king-salman-bin-abdulaziz-al-saud-of-saudi-arabia/

Funny Jim now you and conservatives are using another oppressive leader who kills journalists. To disparage the POTUS
Sounds about right



Yet You people can’t make up your minds your upset he called Saudi to increase oil . And upset they didn’t pick up the phone?

Maybe that’s what happens when Biden wants to hold them accountable for killing of Khashoggi

Then you have The lie Republicans keep repeating

America can easily replace #PutinOil by producing more of our own,” said Marco Rubio but suggesting Biden controls production

FYI. Guess who ask Saudi to increase oil production

U.S. President Donald Trump said he asked Saudi Arabia to significantly boost its oil production, ratcheting up pressure on Riyadh to help ease fast-rising crude prices.
June 30

and no Republicans told Trump just pump more oil..

so American oil couldn’t just pump more oil in 2018 but they can in 2022

Then he ask them to cut production

Trump told Saudi: Cut oil supply or lose U.S. military support - sources

Trump bragged that he protected the Saudi crown prince from consequences in the United States after the assassination of Khashoggi in October 2018,

must be hyperbole thank god it’s not curing cancer

Seems many suffer from historical amnesia
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Once again you chase the laser pointer

The world is with America

Saudi and the UAE. The size of Maine do not represent the world


Persian Gulf monarchies have signaled they won’t help ease surging oil prices unless Washington supports them in Yemen or grant the Saudi king immunity for killing
Khashoggi


The White House unsuccessfully tried to arrange calls between President Biden and the de facto leaders of Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates as the U.S. was working to build international support for Ukraine and contain a surge in oil prices, said Middle East and U.S. officials.

So Biden spoke to him a few weeks ago , https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2022/02/09/readout-of-president-joseph-r-biden-jr-s-call-with-king-salman-bin-abdulaziz-al-saud-of-saudi-arabia/

Funny Jim now you and conservatives are using another oppressive leader who kills journalists. To disparage the POTUS
Sounds about right



Yet You people can’t make up your minds your upset he called Saudi to increase oil . And upset they didn’t pick up the phone?

Maybe that’s what happens when Biden wants to hold them accountable for killing of Khashoggi

Then you have The lie Republicans keep repeating

America can easily replace #PutinOil by producing more of our own,” said Marco Rubio but suggesting Biden controls production

FYI. Guess who ask Saudi to increase oil production

U.S. President Donald Trump said he asked Saudi Arabia to significantly boost its oil production, ratcheting up pressure on Riyadh to help ease fast-rising crude prices.
June 30

and no Republicans told Trump just pump more oil..

so American oil couldn’t just pump more oil in 2018 but they can in 2022

Then he ask them to cut production

Trump told Saudi: Cut oil supply or lose U.S. military support - sources


Seems many suffer from historical amnesia
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i asked you how you interpreted it, seems like a benign question.

i don’t need to disparage Biden. He does it to himself.
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i asked you how you interpreted it, seems like a benign question.

i don’t need to disparage Biden. He does it to himself.
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I lay it out for .. only you are looking for hidden meanings

I am sure Saudi and UAE are happy with the price of oil , and they can’t condemn Russia while doing the same thing in Yemen , Big picture
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I lay it out for .. only you are looking for hidden meanings

I am sure Saudi and UAE are happy with the price of oil , and they can’t condemn Russia while doing the same thing in Yemen , Big picture
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you laid out your spin, and you act as if it’s objective fact.

of course they can condemn russia while doing the same thing, that’s what immoral dictators do.
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NEW: leaked Kremlin docs asking Tucker, Gabbard and Greenwald to tone it down a bit to be a little more credible
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Citibank still operating in Russia.... Right up there with Bank of America as top two banks screwing American public.

Koch industries said they have no plans on leaving Russia.

you laid out your spin, and you act as if it’s objective fact.

of course they can condemn russia while doing the same thing, that’s what immoral dictators do.
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you laid out your spin, and you act as if it’s objective fact.

it is fact not spin , do some research All what I posted

So what about Donald Trump he asked Saudi Arabia to significantly boost its oil production, ratcheting up pressure on Riyadh to help ease fast-rising crude prices.


Didn't see republicans saying anything then But Know OMG

So what about Donald Trump he asked Saudi Arabia to significantly boost its oil production, ratcheting up pressure on Riyadh to help ease fast-rising crude prices.


Didn't see republicans saying anything then But Know OMG

Was gas ever this high when Trump was POTUS?

Talk about false equivalency you accuse me of!

Russia has sanctioned a bunch of Biden administration officials, which makes sense, because the Biden administration is the one sanctioning Russia. But, for some reason, Russia also sanctioned...Hillary Clinton. But not Donald Trump. I wonder why.
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Russia has sanctioned a bunch of Biden administration officials, which makes sense, because the Biden administration is the one sanctioning Russia. But, for some reason, Russia also sanctioned...Hillary Clinton. But not Donald Trump. I wonder why.
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Heavens to Betsy!

Russia has sanctioned a bunch of Biden administration officials, which makes sense, because the Biden administration is the one sanctioning Russia. But, for some reason, Russia also sanctioned...Hillary Clinton. But not Donald Trump. I wonder why.
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Clinton tweeted that she would like to thank the Russian Academy for the Lifetime Achievement Award. Lol
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Clinton tweeted that she would like to thank the Russian Academy for the Lifetime Achievement Award. Lol
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probably happy to have finally won something....

Glad to see she finally shattered that glass ceiling :hee:
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Well, at least Ukraine didn't escalate over the past week :eek:

Seems like it’s easy for GOP lawmakers to support Zelensky now. the war is horrific, constituents are upset, they can pressure a Democratic president

hard when it meant holding Trump accountable for delaying military aid to extort him for political favors

247 of 248 wouldn't

just Mitt Romney
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Trump accountable . . .delaying military aid to extort him for political favors



Sometimes, often, you're like a broken R2D2 who's radio emissions are stuck on and keep emitting the same stupid useless message . . .

Seems like it’s easy for GOP lawmakers to support Zelensky now. the war is horrific, constituents are upset, they can pressure a Democratic president

hard when it meant holding Trump accountable for delaying military aid to extort him for political favors

247 of 248 wouldn't

just Mitt Romney
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but when biden threatened to withhold aid unless ukraine fired a prosecutor, that’s ok?
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but when biden threatened to withhold aid unless ukraine fired a prosecutor, that’s ok?
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While former Vice President Joe Biden oversaw foreign policy in Ukraine, his son Hunter Biden served on the board of Burisma Holdings, the largest gas company in the fledgling democracy.

Despite a recently concluded investigation by Senate Republicans that found no wrongdoing by the Bidens, claims to the contrary have continued to circulate on social media.
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While former Vice President Joe Biden oversaw foreign policy in Ukraine, his son Hunter Biden served on the board of Burisma Holdings, the largest gas company in the fledgling democracy.

Despite a recently concluded investigation by Senate Republicans that found no wrongdoing by the Bidens, claims to the contrary have continued to circulate on social media.
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did biden threaten to withhold
aid from ukraine unless they fired a prosecutor?
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The claim: Joe Biden threatened to withhold $1 billion from Ukraine to assist his son, Hunter Biden

While former Vice President Joe Biden oversaw foreign policy in Ukraine, his son Hunter Biden served on the board of Burisma Holdings, the largest gas company in the fledgling democracy.

Despite a recently concluded investigation by Senate Republicans that found no wrongdoing by the Bidens, claims to the contrary have continued to circulate on social media.
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did biden threaten to withhold
aid from ukraine unless they fired a prosecutor?
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wow your back in deep with the conspiracy theories

Care to tell US Why he threatened to withhold Aid?/ its no secret

I'll Wait

wow your back in deep with the conspiracy theories

Care to tell US Why he threatened to withhold Aid?/ its no secret

I'll Wait

Your first sentence seems to suggest that Biden didn't actually threaten to withhold aid, and that I'm engaging in conspiracy theories. Then your next sentence seems to suggest that everyone knows Biden threatened to withhold aid.

You asked if I could say why he threatened to withhold aid. Here's my post you responded to:


"did biden threaten to withhold aid from ukraine unless they fired a prosecutor?"

WDMSO, when you read that sentence, it's not crystal clear why I believe Biden threatened to withhold aid?

You might want to get an MRI.

Biden threatened to withhold national aid to Ukraine, unless they fired a prosecutor we claim was corrupt. It's worth withholding aid to a nation to get rid of one corrupt lawyer?

Polifact:

• Vice President Joe Biden did urge Ukraine to fire its top prosecutor, with the threat of withholding U.S. aid. But that was the position of the wider U.S. government, as well as other international institutions.

• We found no evidence to support the idea that Joe Biden advocated with his son's interests in mind, as the message suggests. It's not even clear that the company was actively under investigation or that a change in prosecutors benefited it.

and a link for another article:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2020/10/21/fact-check-joe-biden-leveraged-ukraine-aid-oust-corrupt-prosecutor/5991434002/

Polifact:



nobody believes Polifact(?) anymore....

Your first sentence seems to suggest that Biden didn't actually threaten to withhold aid, and that I'm engaging in conspiracy theories. Then your next sentence seems to suggest that everyone knows Biden threatened to withhold aid.

You asked if I could say why he threatened to withhold aid. Here's my post you responded to:


"did biden threaten to withhold aid from ukraine unless they fired a prosecutor?"

WDMSO, when you read that sentence, it's not crystal clear why I believe Biden threatened to withhold aid?

You might want to get an MRI.

Biden threatened to withhold national aid to Ukraine, unless they fired a prosecutor we claim was corrupt. It's worth withholding aid to a nation to get rid of one corrupt lawyer?

hunter's laptop was russian disinformation too...whoops...not any more apparently

hunter's laptop was russian disinformation too...whoops...not any more apparently

New York Times finally confirms Hunter Biden's laptop after dismissing it amid 2020 campaign:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/new-york-times-finally-confirms-hunter-biden-s-laptop-after-dismissing-it-amid-2020-campaign/ar-AAVcFRL?ocid=msnews

hunter's laptop was russian disinformation too...whoops...not any more apparently

nothing like the press doing their jobs.
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Jared Kushner helped Saudi Arabia cover up the murder of Jamal Khashoggi.

He covered up the truth about Covid, seized PPE to stockpile, & took millions in PPP loans.

Saudi Arabia gave him $2B.

But do go on about how Hunter Biden has the corruption problem.
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Jared Kushner helped Saudi Arabia cover up the murder of Jamal Khashoggi.

He covered up the truth about Covid, seized PPE to stockpile, & took millions in PPP loans.

Saudi Arabia gave him $2B.

But do go on about how Hunter Biden has the corruption problem.
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you'd think the biden administration who arrest him....

you'd think the biden administration who arrest him....

You have the same idea of how that works as Tweety
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Your first sentence seems to suggest that Biden didn't actually threaten to withhold aid, and that I'm engaging in conspiracy theories. Then your next sentence seems to suggest that everyone knows Biden threatened to withhold aid.

You asked if I could say why he threatened to withhold aid. Here's my post you responded to:


"did biden threaten to withhold aid from ukraine unless they fired a prosecutor?"

WDMSO, when you read that sentence, it's not crystal clear why I believe Biden threatened to withhold aid? No it isn’t

You might want to get an MRI.

Biden threatened to withhold national aid to Ukraine, unless they fired a prosecutor we claim was corrupt. It's worth withholding aid to a nation to get rid of one corrupt lawyer?

the international community supported the move to remove . as you say just a lawyer! Which he wasn’t ! He was Prosecutor General of Ukraine or their AG WHO wasn’t prosecuting corruption cases

Shokin wasn't pursuing corruption among the country's politicians, according to a Ukrainian official and four former American officials who specialized in Ukraine and Europe.

Shokin's inaction prompted international calls for his ouster and ultimately resulted in his removal by Ukraine's parliament.

Without pressure from Joe Biden, European diplomats, the International Monetary Fund and other international organizations, Shokin would not have been fired, said Daria Kaleniuk, co-founder and executive director of the Anti Corruption

keep trying to suggest what Biden did and Trump did aka withholding aid from Ukraine .

Are the same. And if that’s not the point your trying to make . Who knows what it is
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nobody believes Polifact(?) anymore....

You don’t believe anything .

Unless it’s fictional
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Hunter Biden has the corruption problem.
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Don't know if it's a "problem" . . . with his dad being in charge of the DOJ. But you're right, he is corrupt.

Don't know if it's a "problem" . . . with his dad being in charge of the DOJ. But you're right, he is corrupt.

You’re confusing the Biden admin\Garland DOJ with the Trump Barr administration but what else would I expect

Getting into arguments with you or Jim is the colloquial equivalent of stepping in really bad dog #^&#^&#^&#^&, it'll follow you around for a bit and stink up everything you try to do but in the end it won't matter at all.
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You’re confusing the Biden admin\Garland DOJ with the Trump Barr administration but what else would I expect

No . . . I said Hunter's father was in charge of the DOJ.
No confusion there.

Getting into arguments with you or Jim is the colloquial equivalent of stepping in really bad dog #^&#^&#^&#^&, it'll follow you around for a bit and stink up everything you try to do but in the end it won't matter at all.
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Sounds like, for some strange reason, you have this burning need to continuously step in really stinky dong$hit.

Tweety’s the one who thought he could order indictments
Remember “lock her up”
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Before invading, Putin made assessments. One was that America was badly divided and fractured. Putin had experienced four years of Trump. What a godsend! Arrogant America electing a useful idiot! Without HIS assessment of OUR division, this war would NOT be happening!
Putin's desire to reconstruct the USSR is an overstated narrative. What he is really obsessed with, is America, NATO, and most of all - Democracy. What's his goal? TO DIMINISH THEM. Why? Because if he can, the rest falls into place! Ukraine was the democracy on his doorstep.
So after he saw the great America elect a moron, he saw the GOP willingly embrace his help i an unbridled lust to regain power. He's seen millions of Americans buy into false narratives and strongman propaganda. He saw potential for American democracy ITSELF to be controlled.
What Putin saw in America is TrumpISM - a shadow and mirror of Trump's malignancy. Where authoritarians are admired as manly and strong. Winning is everything. An apparatus of enablers, amplifiers, and grifters, united in a quest to attain power with Minority Rule at ANY cost
Go back to the day of the invasion. Trump immediately spewed Putin-friendly fuel on the fire. Then came Pompeo! Then Carlson, who's never stopped spewing! Russian media began playing Trump/Pompeo/Carlson on endless video loops! THIS was what Putin expected, and he got it.
But Putin's other assessments were faulty. He underestimated Zelensky's leadership, Ukrainians' bravery, and their will to fight. Mostly, he underestimated NATO's unity, due in no small part to Biden/Blinken and their ability to telegraph Putin's planned propaganda in advance
THANK GOD FOR BIDEN! Because the solidarity of NATO crippled Putin. It also changed the political calculus of the power-crazed American GOP. Not for humanitarian reasons. They simply read the room and knew their best alternative was to now flip TO Ukraine and AWAY from Putin.
REMEMBER THIS: The GOP cares for NOTHING above power! They politicize EVERYTHING! They'd sell their own mothers in a flash. So even though they act against Putin now, he knows if he somehow waits this out, the US GOP will assuredly welcome his help with US midterm elections.
Whatever happens in Ukraine, America HAS to vanquish its TRUE foe. It's not Putin. And it's not Trump. It's PROPAGANDA. Authoritarianism can ONLY grow in an environment of DISINFORMATION. Disinformation and propaganda are everywhere now. It's constant. Relentless. Amplified.
In 2022, American Democracy itself WILL be on the line. Democracy HAS to prevail! How? The TRUTH. The truth is the only archenemy of the lie. And the truth is STRONGER than the lie. So, for Democracy to prevail, enough TRUTH has to prevail!
In 2020, we spoke TRUTH about the aberrant pathological behavior of Trump in our film #UNFIT. It spoke to his autocratic aspirations - which we hear daily. Our film was widely distributed; widely seen. It made a difference. It crossed over to moderates. There's still many!
In 2022, before the midterms, we will release #UNTRUTH - the Psychology of TrumpISM and the War for Democracy. It will speak to Trumpism and make sense to ANYONE who watches it. Almost everybody watches films. And when they watch, they're away from the mob, away from noise.
#UNTRUTH must be a fiercely independent film, like #UNFIT. It's the only way films like these can be made to elicit results. If enough truth prevails, democracy will prevail! The better we convey what Trumpism really is, the more that understand it, the better chance we have
Here's a link. Please click it, watch the short trailer at the top, then scroll down and read the truth about Trumpism. It's behavioral psychology. And it's there. We hope you'll also consider supporting the effort (there's only a few days left).
bit.ly/34DmQZP
We're all in this together. Democracy is the thing most worth fighting for; and it really IS on the line. So we need to be ALL IN.

Thanks for reading this thread.
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Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov is praising Fox News' coverage of its war on Ukraine, hailing it as ''trying to represent some alternative points of view'' and denouncing ''information terrorism.''


:btu:

Every single House member who voted to keep Russia’s most favored nation trade status is a Republican.

Every.
Single.
One.
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If you don't get how vital the battle for Ukraine is, let Sergei Lavrov explain:

"This is not about Ukraine at all, but the world order. The current crisis is a fateful, epoch-making moment in modern history. It reflects the battle over what the world order will look like".
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If you don't get how vital the battle for Ukraine is, let Sergei Lavrov explain:

"This is not about Ukraine at all, but the world order. The current crisis is a fateful, epoch-making moment in modern history. It reflects the battle over what the world order will look like".
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The battle for determining the American order is more vital to Americans than the battle for Ukraine.

The battle for determining the American order is more vital to Americans than the battle for Ukraine.

They’re related

I truly hope most Americans realize how dangerous Trump, GQP, QAnon & MAGA are to democracy and how a Ron DeSantis, whose political career was funded by Russian cash via Matt Gaetz, could easily turn into the world’s next Vladimir Putin.
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They’re related

I truly hope most Americans realize how dangerous Trump, GQP, QAnon & MAGA are to democracy and how a Ron DeSantis, whose political career was funded by Russian cash via Matt Gaetz, could easily turn into the world’s next Vladimir Putin.
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I truly hope that most Americans realize how goofy people are who spout your crazy kind of stuff.

I truly hope that most Americans realize how goofy people are who spout your crazy kind of stuff.

Russia interfered in 2016 in order to further its own political goals, and among them were its designs with regards to Ukraine. The FBI was neutralizing these efforts. Anyone trying to stop, thwart, or cast doubt on that investigation was helping Russia.
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Russia interfered in 2016 in order to further its own political goals, and among them were its designs with regards to Ukraine. The FBI was neutralizing these efforts. Anyone trying to stop, thwart, or cast doubt on that investigation was helping Russia.
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More tricky Pete goofy stuff. The investigation involved more than trying to thwart or stop Russian interference. It was also an attempt to thwart or stop Trump.

It would be logical that those who knew Trump had not conspired with Russia would try to reveal that that part of the "investigation" was bogus. Events unfolded to prove that to be true.

More tricky Pete goofy stuff. The investigation involved more than trying to thwart or stop Russian interference. It was also an attempt to thwart or stop Trump.

It would be logical that those who knew Trump had not conspired with Russia would try to reveal that that part of the "investigation" was bogus. Events unfolded to prove that to be true.

Money Laundering 101: Taught by Donald Trump & his adult children.

Trump/Putin by the numbers: 1.9 Trillion leaves Russia during Vladimir’s presidency. 30 Trump Towers built across the globe selling condos to shell corporations owned by Russian Mobsters (oligarchs.)

Money Laundering 101: Taught by Donald Trump & his adult children.

Trump/Putin by the numbers: 1.9 Trillion leaves Russia during Vladimir’s presidency. 30 Trump Towers built across the globe selling condos to shell corporations owned by Russian Mobsters (oligarchs.)

Tell me about it if and when he's convicted. And that deke would not be conspiring to interfere with an election. Like I said, tricky Pete goofy stuff. Accuse and suggest by conjecture.

Tell me about it if and when he's convicted. And that deke would not be conspiring to interfere with an election. Like I said, tricky Pete goofy stuff. Accuse and suggest by conjecture.

Your boy is the one who lied.
During a news conference held days before his inauguration, Trump said, “I have no dealings with Russia, I have no deals in Russia, I have no deals that could happen in Russia because we’ve stayed away.”

Yet after the Cohen plea, Trump rewrote history to claim that “everybody knew” about his secret business dealings with Russia. In tweets, Trump even characterized his dealings as “very legal & very cool.”

“I talked about it on the campaign trail,” he claimed, falsely, before adding that he “Lightly looked at doing a building somewhere in Russia.”

He’s been owned for years
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Your boy is the one who lied.
During a news conference held days before his inauguration, Trump said, “I have no dealings with Russia, I have no deals in Russia, I have no deals that could happen in Russia because we’ve stayed away.”

Yet after the Cohen plea, Trump rewrote history to claim that “everybody knew” about his secret business dealings with Russia. In tweets, Trump even characterized his dealings as “very legal & very cool.”

“I talked about it on the campaign trail,” he claimed, falsely, before adding that he “Lightly looked at doing a building somewhere in Russia.”

You've told us about this several times already. Are you concerned that somehow we missed it?


He’s been owned for years


Wait, I thought the oligarchs own our politicians because of Citizens United. Wow, everybody is owned. You keep saying the same stuff over and over . . . as if you were a puppet . . . and you keep repeating the words your owners have fed you.

Vladimir Putin: “NATO is obsolete” and “The European Union is a foe.”

Just kidding, those are Trumps words.
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Vladimir Putin: “NATO is obsolete” and “The European Union is a foe.”

Just kidding, those are Trumps words.
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Here we go with tricky Pete's goofy insinuation, slanting, lying by omission stuff.
Trump said much more than tricky Pete quoted:

LONDON (Reuters) - U.S. President-elect Donald Trump said NATO was obsolete because it had not defended against terror attacks, but that the military alliance was still very important to him, The Times of London reported.

“I took such heat, when I said NATO was obsolete,” Trump told the newspaper in an interview. “It’s obsolete because it wasn’t taking care of terror. I took a lot of heat for two days. And then they started saying Trump is right.”

Trump added that many NATO members were not paying their fair share for U.S. protection.

“A lot of these countries aren’t paying what they’re supposed to be paying, which I think is very unfair to the United States,” Trump said. “With that being said, NATO is very important to me. There’s five countries that are paying what they’re supposed to. Five. It’s not much.”

He said, which Pete left out, that NATO was very important to him. That would not be good for his narrative that Trump is anti NATO. And Russia's invasion and continuing destruction of Ukraine (again) has awoken even prominent members of NATO that it needed to beef itself up and put a strong face against Russia which they were not only not doing when Trump made the statement, but were doing things to economically support Russia and having no effect in forcing Russia to return Crimea. NATO was, indeed, at the time Trump said it, in many respects, obsolete.


As well, on the EU being a foe, Pete left out the part of being a foe on trade. Which creates the false picture of being a foe on everything else, including being a military foe.

BBC headline Donald Trump: European Union is a foe on trade

From the BBC article: Asked to name his biggest competitor and foe globally, the US president said there were "a lot of foes" and named Russia and China among them, but the first on his list was the EU.

"I think the European Union is a foe, what they do to us in trade. Now you wouldn't think of the European Union but they're a foe," he said.

"In a trade sense, they've really taken advantage of us and many of those countries are in Nato and they weren't paying their bills and, you know, as an example a big problem with Germany," he said.

He then returned to the theme of Germany's reliance on Nord Stream 2, a pipeline which will increase the flow of gas to EU states and which he controversially criticised ahead of last week's Nato summit.

He said: "There's a lot of anger at the fact that Germany is paying Russia billions of dollars."

I especially can see why Pete left out the part of Trump saying Russia was a foe--not good for a Putin puppet to say such stuff. It's also evident that Pete is a class A propagandist and a tricky liar.

Here we go with tricky Pete's goofy insinuation, slanting, lying by omission stuff.
Trump said much more than tricky Pete quoted:

LONDON (Reuters) - U.S. President-elect Donald Trump said NATO was obsolete because it had not defended against terror attacks, but that the military alliance was still very important to him, The Times of London reported.


Baloney
NATO’s Article V, which states: “an armed attack against one or more [member countries] in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all.”
Article V has been invoked only one time in the 70-year history of NATO: on September 12, 2001 by the non-American allies after the 9/11 terrorist attacks on the U.S.
In Afghanistan alone, NATO allies have lost around 1,000 service members in support of coalition operations. U.S. allies also form the backbone of support for the global coalition to counter the Islamic State, which consisted of 81 partner nations.

“I took such heat, when I said NATO was obsolete,” Trump told the newspaper in an interview. “It’s obsolete because it wasn’t taking care of terror. I took a lot of heat for two days. And then they started saying Trump is right.”

Trump added that many NATO members were not paying their fair share for U.S. protection.



“A lot of these countries aren’t paying what they’re supposed to be paying, which I think is very unfair to the United States,” Trump said. “With that being said, NATO is very important to me. There’s five countries that are paying what they’re supposed to. Five. It’s not much.”

More of your Baloney
We do not deploy our forces as mercenaries for hire, simply to defend the territory of U.S. allies. America’s global defense network allows it to more quickly and effectively address a range of global requirements, including protecting American citizens, preventing piracy, deterring violent extremism, and preventing countries like North Korea and Iran from trafficking illicit weapons. U.S. allies work alongside the U.S. in all of these efforts.

America’s allies also defray significant portions of the cost of its overseas military facilities, spending billions of dollars to offset costs the U.S. would otherwise bear alone. Allies contribute to the cost of U.S. facilities both directly and indirectly, through cash payments; in-kind payments such as tax and fee waivers; covering construction costs for U.S. housing and training facilities; and the rent-free provision of valuable real estate to U.S. forces

He said, which Pete left out, that NATO was very important to him. That would not be good for his narrative that Trump is anti NATO. And Russia's invasion and continuing destruction of Ukraine (again) has awoken even prominent members of NATO that it needed to beef itself up and put a strong face against Russia which they were not only not doing when Trump made the statement, but were doing things to economically support Russia and having no effect in forcing Russia to return Crimea. NATO was, indeed, at the time Trump said it, in many respects, obsolete.


As well, on the EU being a foe, Pete left out the part of being a foe on trade. Which creates the false picture of being a foe on everything else, including being a military foe.

BBC headline Donald Trump: European Union is a foe on trade

From the BBC article: Asked to name his biggest competitor and foe globally, the US president said there were "a lot of foes" and named Russia and China among them, but the first on his list was the EU.

"I think the European Union is a foe, what they do to us in trade. Now you wouldn't think of the European Union but they're a foe," he said.

"In a trade sense, they've really taken advantage of us and many of those countries are in Nato and they weren't paying their bills and, you know, as an example a big problem with Germany," he said.

He then returned to the theme of Germany's reliance on Nord Stream 2, a pipeline which will increase the flow of gas to EU states and which he controversially criticised ahead of last week's Nato summit.

He said: "There's a lot of anger at the fact that Germany is paying Russia billions of dollars."

I especially can see why Pete left out the part of Trump saying Russia was a foe--not good for a Putin puppet to say such stuff. It's also evident that Pete is a class A propagandist and a tricky liar.

He said that the EU was a foe the week before he met with Putin in Helsinki where Trump standing by Mr. Putin’s side, dismissed the conclusions by U.S. intelligence agencies about Russian meddling.
“They said they think it’s Russia,” Mr. Trump said. “I have President Putin; he just said it’s not Russia.” For good measure, he said, “President Putin was extremely strong and powerful in his denial today.”


Trump as president:
Illegally withheld weapons from Ukraine
Wanted to let Russia back in the G8
Wanted US to leave NATO
Reduced sanctions to let Russian GDP grow again

So from Paul Manafort in 2016 to Tucker Carlson in 2022, with Trump as a constant throughout, and for reasons both financial and ideological, important parts of the Republican Party and the conservative movement have been pro-Putin. and you don't think this emboldened Putin to act?

I'll also point out that Trump was spouting anti-NATO bile since a Moscow trip in 1987. He also formed an exploratory committee for president at that time.
You should wonder what happened on that trip.

Every single House member who voted to keep Russia’s most favored nation trade status is a Republican.

Every.
Single.
One.
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Again, you quote exactly word for word (even with the exact spacing) of someone with neither quotes nor attribution to the author--Star Trek's George Takei, not exactly the most well informed political analyst.

So 8 out of 212 Republican House members voting in a certain way is supposed to be a reflection on the Republican Party?

"The revocation carries mostly symbolic weight. Because Russian imports into the U.S. are primarily natural resources, they would generally face little to no increase in their tariffs because of the lost status, Ed Gresser of the Progressive Policy Institute in Washington, said in an online post."

The eight had reasons for their vote which Takei fails to mention or doesn't know.

Whoopie! Eight out of two hundred and twelve--every . . . single . . . one! You go get em Pete. Great job of making a mountain out of a molehill fake picture to show how evil Republicans are. Propaganda at its finest.

Again, you quote exactly word for word (even with the exact spacing) of someone with neither quotes nor attribution to the author--Star Trek's George Takei, not exactly the most well informed political analyst.

So 8 out of 212 Republican House members voting in a certain way is supposed to be a reflection on the Republican Party?

"The revocation carries mostly symbolic weight. Because Russian imports into the U.S. are primarily natural resources, they would generally face little to no increase in their tariffs because of the lost status, Ed Gresser of the Progressive Policy Institute in Washington, said in an online post."

The eight had reasons for their vote which Takei fails to mention or doesn't know.

Whoopie! Eight out of two hundred and twelve--every . . . single . . . one! You go get em Pete. Great job of making a mountain out of a molehill fake picture to show how evil Republicans are. Propaganda at its finest.

Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene (R-GA) blames Ukraine for being invaded: "You see Ukraine just kept poking the bear, poking the bear, which is Russia, and Russia invaded. And the hard truth is ... there is no win for Ukraine here. Russia is being very successful in their invasion."

Baloney
NATO’s Article V, which states: “an armed attack against one or more [member countries] in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all.”
Article V has been invoked only one time in the 70-year history of NATO: on September 12, 2001 by the non-American allies after the 9/11 terrorist attacks on the U.S.
In Afghanistan alone, NATO allies have lost around 1,000 service members in support of coalition operations. U.S. allies also form the backbone of support for the global coalition to counter the Islamic State, which consisted of 81 partner

This was supposedly a reply to my post that showed you did not include Trump's saying that the military alliance with NATO was very important to him when he said it was obsolete.
By leaving that part of the statement out you give the impression that he is against NATO, that it would be anything but important to him.
Even that he wanted no part of it and would pull out of it.

More of your Baloney
We do not deploy our forces as mercenaries for hire, simply to defend the territory of U.S. allies. America’s global defense network allows it to more quickly and effectively address a range of global requirements, including protecting American citizens, preventing piracy, deterring violent extremism, and preventing countries like North Korea and Iran from trafficking illicit weapons. U.S. allies work alongside the U.S. in all of these efforts.

America’s allies also defray significant portions of the cost of its overseas military facilities, spending billions of dollars to offset costs the U.S. would otherwise bear alone. Allies contribute to the cost of U.S. facilities both directly and indirectly, through cash payments; in-kind payments such as tax and fee waivers; covering construction costs for U.S. housing and training facilities; and the rent-free provision of valuable real estate to U.S. forces

This was in response to Trump saying many NATO members were not paying their share (agreed upon 2% of GDP). You did not deny that what he said is true, instead you try to point out other costs they pay as if that makes up for their shorting the agreed on share. That does not cut it, nor does it make Trump's remark "baloney." The U.S. also incurs other costs besides the agreed on share. And both the U.S. and the other NATO countries would also pay those other costs if they paid their agreed on share.

And, BTW, they quickly more than coughed up the money when Putin started the war with Ukraine. Trump was right.


He said that the EU was a foe the week before he met with Putin in Helsinki where Trump standing by Mr. Putin’s side, dismissed the conclusions by U.S. intelligence agencies about Russian meddling.
“They said they think it’s Russia,” Mr. Trump said. “I have President Putin; he just said it’s not Russia.” For good measure, he said, “President Putin was extremely strong and powerful in his denial today.”

This was your response to when I pointed out that Trump said that the EU was a foe, he specifically said they were a foe on trade. And many Americans thought that was true well before Trump said it. And many, including me, think he is right. In trade they have been a foe for a long time. That does not make them an enemy. It makes them economic competitors. When you left out what kind of foe, quoting Trump as unqualifiedly saying that the EU is a foe, that gave the kind of impression you like to make of Trump being against European allies and absolutely pro-Putin. It's a propaganda trick. It's lie by omission and by implication or insinuation. It's what you do.

Trump as president:
Illegally withheld weapons from Ukraine

The weapons were delivered on time, barely.

Wanted to let Russia back in the G8

Trump said: "It has come up, should we put Russia back in? We spend a lot of time talking about Russia at those meetings and they're not there. I think it would be a good thing if Russia were there so we can speak directly, not have to speak by telephone and other things.

So, here is the thing: It is a vote of what is now the G-7. They were taken out because Putin outsmarted on Crimea, on the red line, on other things. Totally outsmarted Obama. Obama was upset. They took 'em out. I think Russia should be a part of it because we're looking for world peace. And other things. Trade and other things. And it would be a lot easier to have Russia in where they have always been."

Of course you will disagree with his reasons, that they are stupid, etc., and will probably say or think that he lied and was just doing Putin's bidding. You only seem to believe Trump when he says something outrageously wrong. If he says good things, you believe he is lying.


Wanted US to leave NATO


He didn't say that he wanted the US to leave NATO:

https://www.factcheck.org/2016/05/whats-trumps-position-on-nato/

Clinton again claimed that Trump, whom she referred to as a “loose cannon,” wants out of NATO.


While Trump has gone so far as saying that, as president, he would consider pulling the U.S. out of NATO if it is not restructured, we’ve found no instance of him saying he wants to do so at this point. And the Clinton campaign hasn’t been able to point to an example of Trump saying that either.

In fact, it was during the interview with the Post, which initially brought attention to Trump’s feelings about NATO, that Trump said that he doesn’t want the U.S. to leave the alliance.

Trump: No, I don’t want to pull it out. NATO was set up at a different time. NATO was set up when we were a richer country. We’re not a rich country anymore. We’re borrowing, we’re borrowing all of this money. We’re borrowing money from China, which is sort of an amazing situation. But it was a much different thing. NATO is costing us a fortune and yes, we’re protecting Europe with NATO but we’re spending a lot of money. Number one, I think the distribution of costs has to be changed. I think NATO as a concept is good, but it is not as good as it was when it first evolved.

Blitzer: Do you think the United States needs to rethink U.S. involvement in NATO?

Trump: Yes, because it’s costing us too much money. And frankly they have to put up more money. They’re going to have to put some up also. We’re paying disproportionately. It’s too much. And frankly it’s a different world than it was when we originally conceived of the idea. And everybody got together.

Blitzer: So you’re really suggesting the United States should decrease its role in NATO?

Trump: Not decrease its role but certainly decrease the kind of spending. We are spending a tremendous amount in NATO and other people proportionately less. No good.

Then, on March 25, in an interview with the New York Times editorial board, Trump again said that NATO needed to be “changed” to deal with costs and other issues, such as terrorism.

It was on March 23, during an interview with Bloomberg Politics’ Mark Halperin and John Heilemann, that Trump, when asked, said he would “certainly look at” getting rid of NATO because it “may be obsolete” (16:12 in the video).

Halperin, March 23: Should America be the leader of NATO or not necessarily?

Trump: I think NATO may be obsolete. NATO was set up a long time ago — many, many years ago when things were different. Things are different now. We were a rich nation then. We had nothing but money. We had nothing but power. And you know, far more than we have today, in a true sense. And I think NATO — you have to really examine NATO. And it doesn’t really help us, it’s helping other countries. And I don’t think those other countries appreciate what we’re doing.

Heilemann: So, just to be clear, you made two slightly different arguments there and I just want to clarify. One of them is that you might want to see the U.S. pay less money into NATO because …

Trump: That one definitely. That one definitely.

Heilemann: But it’s possible that NATO is obsolete and should be gotten rid of?

Trump: It’s possible. It’s possible. I would certainly look at it. And I’d want more help from other people. The one thing definitely — we’re paying too much. As to whether or not it’s obsolete, I’ll make that determination.

Then, at a campaign rally in Milwaukee on April 4, Trump said that he wasn’t saying that NATO should disband during his interview with CNN’s Blitzer. Instead, he said he meant that if countries “can’t pay their bills … they’ve got to go.”

Trump, April 4: And Wolf Blitzer asked me a question on television. He said, let me just ask you about NATO. And he asked me about it. Now, I haven’t been asked about NATO a lot, but I understand NATO and I understand common sense and I’m, like, a smart person, like many of the people in this room, hopefully all of the people in this room.

But he asked me about NATO. I said it’s obsolete. This is my first thing. And you know what? I’m the first one. Guys that study NATO and good people, but they study NATO and they say, I don’t believe it, what he just said, I never thought of that. They study it because they’re so into it that they don’t realize.

Because it was really put there — you had the Soviet Union and now you have Russia, which is different, but Russia is very powerful, so we can sort of say that’s a balance, so we’ll leave it. But it doesn’t really cover terrorism like it’s supposed to. It doesn’t have the right countries. I mean, many of the countries in there aren’t, you know, that you associate with terrorism.

And so I said, number one, it’s obsolete. I said, number two, to the best of my knowledge, the United States pays far too much proportionately, and why are we always paying the bills to protect other people?

And the press, which is so totally dishonest, the press goes headlines the next day “Trump doesn’t want NATO, wants to disband.” That’s not what I said. I said you’ve got to pay your bills. And you know what? If they can’t pay their bills, honestly there should be — they’ve got to go. Because we can’t do this.

And most recently, in his April 27 foreign policy speech, Trump said that “the U.S. must be prepared to let these countries defend themselves” if they are unwilling to pay more.

Trump, April 27: They look at the United States as weak and forgiving and feel no obligation to honor their agreements with us. In NATO, for instance, only four of 28 other member countries besides America, are spending the minimum required 2 percent of GDP on defense. We have spent trillions of dollars over time on planes, missiles, ships, equipment, building up our military to provide a strong defense for Europe and Asia. The countries we are defending must pay for the cost of this defense, and if not, the U.S. must be prepared to let these countries defend themselves. We have no choice.

So, Trump has clearly outlined changes he would like to see made to NATO. And he has said that, under a Trump administration, the U.S. might no longer be a part of the alliance if it isn’t restructured and other nations don’t start to pick up more of the costs. But even that isn’t the same thing as saying that “we should pull out of NATO,” as Clinton claims Trump said.


Reduced sanctions to let Russian GDP grow again

From a July 25, 2020 article: What has President Trump done in relation to Russia during his time in office? Here are only a handful of examples:

* Imposed sanctions on Russian companies and Russian entities, blocking at least $3 billion worth of deals from going into Russian coffers.

* Placed harsh economic restrictions on a group of Russian oligarchs which effectively puts more pressure on Vladimir Putin. The Russian leader has illegally amassed enormous wealth – exceeding $25 billion – in the last two decades, but he can't hold all that wealth in his own name, so he appointed oligarch cronies to be his trustees. Putting his oligarchs on sanctions hurts Putin big tim

* Levied considerable financial sanctions and travel restrictions on 50-plus individuals who have been accused of human-rights abuses and corruption under both the Magnitsky Act and the Global Magnitsky Act.

* Criticized NATO allies for not spending enough on defense (and was accused by the lamestream media of encouraging Russia to test alliance resolve). NATO allies, however, have taken steps to pay more, and NATO appears stronger than before, which is decidedly not the outcome Putin wanted.

* Authorized the expulsion of 60 Russian diplomats from the U.S. in the wake of nerve agent attack on British soil, allegedly at the hands of the Kremlin.

* Approved the export of lethal weapons, including American-made Javelin antitank missiles, to help Ukraine shore up its eastern defenses against separatists backed by Moscow. More defense cooperation with Ukraine, as well as weapons sales are on the near horizon.

* Killed more than 200 Russian soldiers in Syria – U.S. troops are present as in Syria as much to limit Russian and Iranian influence on the country’s future as to fight the remnants of the Islamic State.

* Facilitated U.S. sales of more coal to energy-strapped Ukraine, while weakening Russia's hold on oil exports.

* Ramped up militarily to pressure the Russian Federation as Secretary of State Mike Pompeo and the Defense Secretary work to strengthen alliances and military cooperation with Baltic states that share borders with Russia.

* Offered a proposal to Poland to host a permanent contingent of U.S. troops, in the way that Germany and Italy have done since World War II, to help secure Poland’s 180-mile long border with Russia.

* Discussed with Ukraine’s president the enhancement of cooperation in security and defense sectors, and the importance of keeping tight sanctions on Russia – to Putin a most unwelcome development.

* Pressured Germany over its status as the largest buyer of Russian natural gas, and as a huge buyer of Russia coal and mineral oil.

* Sanctioned four Russian entities and seven individuals in response to a 2018 attempt to interfere in U.S. midterm elections, including Russian financier Yevgeniy Prigozhin, a wealthy loyalist nicknamed "Putin's chef" who has his mitts in many pies.

* Suspended its obligations under the 1987 Intermediate-range Nuclear Forces Treaty because Russia was not complying with it.

In all, as a Brookings Institute analysis revealed, the Trump administration has enacted more than 50 sanctions or policy actions on Russia, many being severe, from May 15, 2017 – four months after Trump took office – to the present day. But the Left would much prefer that you remain ignorant about these.


So from Paul Manafort in 2016 to Tucker Carlson in 2022, with Trump as a constant throughout, and for reasons both financial and ideological, important parts of the Republican Party and the conservative movement have been pro-Putin. and you don't think this emboldened Putin to act?

I'll also point out that Trump was spouting anti-NATO bile since a Moscow trip in 1987. He also formed an exploratory committee for president at that time.
You should wonder what happened on that trip.

You've been spouting anti-Trump, anti-Republican bile for five or six years. A whole lot of the spouts have been lies and propaganda.

remember when Brandon blamed Russia for Hunter's laptop?....that doesn't seem to be very good parenting

I truly hope that most Americans realize how goofy people are who spout your crazy kind of stuff.


Like three years of Trump is a Russian plant based on a Clinton campaign sourced document? Or that Hunter's laptop was Russian Disinfo?

Pete, don't bother responding with your list of crap on Trump as I generally pass over anything you write these days on that subject. On THAT subject your credibility is nil.

A Jan. 6 Capitol riot suspect wanted by the FBI was granted refugee status in Belarus

Belarus granted Neumann asylum because it believes the charges are politically motivated.

where have we heard that...


is he going to fight with the Russians Next?



https://www.10news.com/news/national/jan-6-suspect-granted-asylum-in-belarus

Russia has attacked Ukraine’s health care system 64 times, WHO says

Punishment that’s all this war is about
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A joke from Moscow: "According to Putin the special military operation is really a conflict btw Russia and NATO about World dominance. Whats the situation now?" "Russia has lost 15000 troops, 6 generals, 500 tanks, 3 ships, 100 planes and 1000 trucks. NATO hasn't arrived yet."
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Even a purely symbolic vote in support of NATO and its principles was opposed by 30 percent of House Republicans on Tuesday.

Why would republicans be against such a vote

Here some reasons Among the emerging views he isolated: that NATO was at fault for provoking Vladimir Putin, that we should focus instead on our own Southern border, and that the United States has no business defending European allies, whether in NATO or otherwise.

Yet. The Senate in 2018 passed a bill reaffirming support for NATO 97-2 — a pretty direct rebuke to Trump given that he was, at that precise time, traveling to a NATO summit in Brussels

Seems Republicans are becoming isolationist.. they should change the party name to the revisionist part

Trying hard to push America back to a point in Time that never existed..
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I bet pootin has kompromat on some of them. We know it’s obvious he has something on trump.
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Even a purely symbolic vote in support of NATO and its principles was opposed by 30 percent of House Republicans on Tuesday.


Why would republicans be against such a vote

Here some reasons Among the emerging views he isolated: that NATO was at fault for provoking Vladimir Putin, that we should focus instead on our own Southern border, and that the United States has no business defending European allies, whether in NATO or otherwise.

Yet. The Senate in 2018 passed a bill reaffirming support for NATO 97-2 — a pretty direct rebuke to Trump given that he was, at that precise time, traveling to a NATO summit in Brussels

Seems Republicans are becoming isolationist.. they should change the party name to the revisionist part

Trying hard to push America back to a point in Time that never existed..
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

"Why would republicans be against such a vote

Here some reasons Among the emerging views he isolated: that NATO was at fault for provoking Vladimir Putin, that we should focus instead on our own Southern border, and that the United States has no business defending European allies, whether in NATO or otherwise."

So you ask why they opposed the bill, then list some speculative reasons (naturally, ugly reasons) why they might have opposed it.

If you actually wanted to know why they opposed it, you could have spent 10 seconds googling it, as some of them were happy to say why they opposed it...this isn't all of the republicans who opposed it, but a few. The bill called for creating a new organization within NATO, and they wanted more time to understand how that would work. They felt rushed.

Those bastards!!

https://www.texastribune.org/2022/04/06/congress-nato-support-texas-representatives/

In the article you obviously stole from (I read the Washington Post article), another republican said it sounded like the new organizaqtion would get to influence the domestic politics of member nations, and he doesn't want NATO telling countries how to govern themselves.

You sure cherry-picked the Washington Post article to find the stiff that painted the GOP in the most negative possible light, didn't you?

Here's your article...here's what one the of the republicans said was his reason, not a very sinister reason, which is why you ignored it!

"We should be strengthening the alliance, not reimagining it as a tool to interfere in one another’s domestic politics.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/04/06/house-gop-nato-support/

Jim 30 % of Republicans no cherry picking at all…. Learn what symbolic means .. please excuse away all of their arguments are built on sand and they’ll move again
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Wonder which members of the Republican Kremlin caucus are going to Moscow for the Fourth of July this year.
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Jim 30 % of Republicans no cherry picking at all…. Learn what symbolic means .. please excuse away all of their arguments are built on sand and they’ll move again
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you made made up the worst possible reasons for why they opposed it. when one of the actual ( but benign) reasons was right in that article but you ignored it. it wasn’t an accident that you highlighted the stupid reasons and ignored the reasonable reason.
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