Blah blah blah 2

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by Nebe

Its pretty obvious.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Actually, dismantling or defanging various oppressive and unconstitutional government bureaucracies is the opposite of fascism.

[spence]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Actually, dismantling or defanging various oppressive and unconstitutional government bureaucracies is the opposite of fascism.

Welcome back. Too bad that’s not what they’re doing.

Here’s a shout out to even more rank stupidity

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/nat...ure-rcna192345

Trump administration wants to un-fire some nuclear safety workers but can’t figure out how to reach them
The individuals, who work in an agency that oversees the nation's nuclear stockpile, had been fired on Thursday and lost access to their federal government email accounts.

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by spence

Welcome back.

Thanks. Didn't really intend to get much involved and am amused at the steadfast opinions. Nothing changed. I guess that's some form of stability. Which, one might guess, is a good thing.

Too bad that’s not what they’re doing.

Yeah, it fundamentally, or incidentally, is what they're doing. It's no secret that I contend that most of the federal regulatory agencies are unconstitutionally granted plenary power to regulate the citizens of this country.

Here’s a shout out to even more rank stupidity

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/nat...ure-rcna192345

No doubt mistakes will be made. And corrected. And it is not only unconstitutional to give plenary power to these agencies, it is fascistic.

[Rmarsh]

Originally Posted by detbuch

No doubt mistakes will be made. And corrected. And it is not only unconstitutional to give plenary power to these agencies, it is fascistic.

I wondered when someone not lockstepp with the resistance would voice some reason and a lot more patience with foolishness. Then again I was on the hockey team and skipped the debate club.

[piemma]

Good to see you back.

[Got Stripers]

If Only.

Warren Buffett, "I could end the deficit in 5 minutes," he told CNBC. "You just pass a law that says that anytime there is a deficit of more than 3% of GDP, all sitting members of Congress are ineligible for re-election. The 26th amendment (granting the right to vote for 18 year-olds) took only 3 months & 8 days to be ratified! Why? Simple! The people demanded it. That was in 1971...before computers, e-mail, cell phones, etc. Of the 27 amendments to the Constitution, seven (7) took 1 year or less to become the law of the land...all because of public pressure.
I am asking each addressee to forward this email to a minimum of twenty people on their address list; in turn ask each of those to do likewise. In three days, most people in The United States of America will have the message. This is one idea that really should be passed around.
*Congressional Reform Act of 2019*
1. No Tenure / No Pension. A Congressman collects a salary while in office and receives no pay when they are out of office.
2. Congress (past, present & future) participates in Social Security. All funds in the Congressional retirement fund move to the Social Security system immediately. All future funds flow into the Social Security system, and Congress participates with the American people. It may not be used for any other purpose.
3. Congress can purchase their own retirement plan, just as all Americans do.
4. Congress will no longer vote themselves a pay raise. Congressional pay will rise by the lower of CPI or 3%.
5. Congress loses their current health care system and participates in the same health care system as the American people.
6. Congress must equally abide by all laws they impose on the American people.
7. All contracts with past and present Congressmen are void effective 7/1/19. The American people did not make this contract with Congressmen. Congressmen made all these contracts for themselves. Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, so ours should serve their term's), then go home and back to work.
If each person contacts a minimum of twenty people then it will only take three days for most people (in the U.S.) to receive the message. Maybe it is time.

[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

If Only.

Warren Buffett, "I could end the deficit in 5 minutes," he told CNBC. "You just pass a law that says that anytime there is a deficit of more than 3% of GDP, all sitting members of Congress are ineligible for re-election. The 26th amendment (granting the right to vote for 18 year-olds) took only 3 months & 8 days to be ratified! Why? Simple! The people demanded it. That was in 1971...before computers, e-mail, cell phones, etc. Of the 27 amendments to the Constitution, seven (7) took 1 year or less to become the law of the land...all because of public pressure.
I am asking each addressee to forward this email to a minimum of twenty people on their address list; in turn ask each of those to do likewise. In three days, most people in The United States of America will have the message. This is one idea that really should be passed around.
*Congressional Reform Act of 2019*
1. No Tenure / No Pension. A Congressman collects a salary while in office and receives no pay when they are out of office.
2. Congress (past, present & future) participates in Social Security. All funds in the Congressional retirement fund move to the Social Security system immediately. All future funds flow into the Social Security system, and Congress participates with the American people. It may not be used for any other purpose.
3. Congress can purchase their own retirement plan, just as all Americans do.
4. Congress will no longer vote themselves a pay raise. Congressional pay will rise by the lower of CPI or 3%.
5. Congress loses their current health care system and participates in the same health care system as the American people.
6. Congress must equally abide by all laws they impose on the American people.
7. All contracts with past and present Congressmen are void effective 7/1/19. The American people did not make this contract with Congressmen. Congressmen made all these contracts for themselves. Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, so ours should serve their term's), then go home and back to work.
If each person contacts a minimum of twenty people then it will only take three days for most people (in the U.S.) to receive the message. Maybe it is time.

That would work.

I would propose term limits for house, senate and courts.
No separate benefit system for elected officials.
That emoluments be enforced.
That a corporation is not a person.
A limit of 8x minimum wage for political contributions.
Sunset provisions in all legislation.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[spence]

Originally Posted by detbuch

No doubt mistakes will be made. And corrected. And it is not only unconstitutional to give plenary power to these agencies, it is fascistic.

Ok Elon, maybe you can make another fake twitter poll so the hackers and bots and will proclaim their verdict.

250 years of unconstitutional actions have led to a situation so dire that it can only rightly be corrected through radical, mostly illegal and insanely irresponsible unconstitutional action. WTF?

For a time I actually thought Reagan Republicans would make a come back. Remember the shining city on a hill inclusive of everyone to be lifted up? Hell, old Ronny was the first DEI president!

“Accidentally” firing the people who keep our nuclear arsenal safe isn’t an “oops” it’s just another example of how they couldn’t give a crap about average Americans. Just like cutting the CDC while we’re on the brink of another outbreak or illegally eliminating USAid which keeps our troops out of harms way is equally illegal and dumb.

But no, let’s weaken our alliances, withdraw our influence and coddle authoritarians and dictators. While we’re at it flaunt the rule of law, suppress the media and eliminate government oversight.

This is all very “Constitutional” and by your reading just what the Founding Fathers envisioned, except it’s what they hoped would never come to be.

Give me a break.

[detbuch]

[QUOTE=spence;1248057
eliminating USAid which keeps our troops out of harms way is equally illegal and dumb.
[/QUOTE]

More on the the good work of USAid:

[wdmso]

Here are only a few examples of the WASTE and ABUSE of USAid:

$1.5 million to “advance diversity equity and inclusion in Serbia’s workplaces and business communities”
$70,000 for production of a “DEI musical” in Ireland
$2.5 million for electric vehicles for Vietnam
$47,000 for a “transgender opera” in Colombia
$32,000 for a “transgender comic book” in Peru
$2 million for sex changes and “LGBT activism” in Guatemala
$6 million to fund tourism in Egypt
Hundreds of thousands of dollars for a non-profit linked to designated terrorist organizations — even AFTER an inspector general launched an investigation
Millions to EcoHealth Alliance — which was involved in research at the Wuhan lab
“Hundreds of thousands of meals that went to al Qaeda-affiliated fighters in Syria”
Funding to print “personalized” contraceptives birth control devices in developing countries
Hundreds of millions of dollars to fund “irrigation canals, farming equipment, and even fertilizer used to support the unprecedented poppy cultivation and heroin production in Afghanistan,” benefiting the Taliban
The list literally goes on and on — and it has all been happening for decades.


What no links I am shocked. Half of what you posted is all BS.

Still where’s the fraud. ? When is Musk. Going to show us what Trumps. USAID funded and spent. During his 1st Term?

But we know you’ll never ask to see that.. it’s not convenient….

Earlier this month the Trump administration described a separate grant of $70,000 (£56,000) for a "DEI musical" in Ireland as "crap" that US taxpayer money was "wasted on

Now an examination of spending records shows that in October 2021 $24,000 (£19,000) of US taxpayer's money was given to the Institute of Art, Design and Technology (IADT) in Dun Laoghaire, Co Dublin, to "nurture and encourage equality, inclusion and diversity in storytelling, by facilitating self-generated narratives from diverse community groups through the medium of film".

Funny how reality never match’s with musk and trumps lies

https://news.sky.com/story/amp/us-ta...oject-13309628..


FYI just because Trump considers it waste and abuse. Because he doesn’t like it.

Doesn’t make it so. The funding was passed by congress and signed by the POTUS

Making it a law. The ones republicans find so pesky .. when they get in their way

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by detbuch

More on the the good work of USAid:

To funny you support a treasonous president Trump. With witness that conveniently try to suggest. Everything was a conspiracy against Trump

It’s a pattern with you and others. The election was rigged Covid was a hoax. USAID tried to get Trump. It’s a hoax. The list is endless

Even when we had the Hero General of Trump. Said this

Former Defense Secretary James Mattis once said, “If you don't fund the State Department fully, then I need to buy more ammunition ultimately.” ...
He became a RINO. Hero to zero…. Because he refused to bend the knee. …

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

To funny you support a treasonous president Trump. With witness that conveniently try to suggest. Everything was a conspiracy against Trump

This is disinformation.

It’s a pattern with you and others. The election was rigged Covid was a hoax. USAID tried to get Trump. It’s a hoax. The list is endless

This is misinformation.

Even when we had the Hero General of Trump. Said this

Former Defense Secretary James Mattis once said, “If you don't fund the State Department fully, then I need to buy more ammunition ultimately.” ...
He became a RINO. Hero to zero…. Because he refused to bend the knee. …

This is malinformation

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by detbuch

More on the the good work of USAid:

questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no sourcing to credible information, a complete lack of transparency and/or is fake news. Fake News is the deliberate attempt to publish hoaxes and/or disinformation for the purpose of profit or influence (Learn More). Sources listed in the Questionable Category may be very untrustworthy and should be fact-checked on a per-article basis. Please note sources on this list are not considered fake news unless specifically written in the reasoning section for that source


Wow that’s your evidence…. Talk about disinformation

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no sourcing to credible information, a complete lack of transparency and/or is fake news. Fake News is the deliberate attempt to publish hoaxes and/or disinformation for the purpose of profit or influence (Learn More). Sources listed in the Questionable Category may be very untrustworthy and should be fact-checked on a per-article basis. Please note sources on this list are not considered fake news unless specifically written in the reasoning section for that source

Good to know.

Wow that’s your evidence…. Talk about disinformation

Is this referring to the video? WTF are you talking about?

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Actually, dismantling or defanging various oppressive and unconstitutional government bureaucracies is the opposite of fascism.

Too bad that is your opinion which isn’t based on facts or laws but rather a feeling …


Also DOGE aims to target staffers who are not in DEI roles and employees who work in offices established by law to ensure equal rights, internal DOGE documents show.

Those pesky laws

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Too bad that is your opinion which isn’t based on facts or laws but rather a feeling …

It is based on the Constitution which does not give Congress the power to delegate its powers and responsibilities. It can establish agencies to investigate, advise, and recommend. But it cannot delegate its power to them to legislate or regulate.

Also DOGE aims to target staffers who are not in DEI roles and employees who work in offices established by law to ensure equal rights, internal DOGE documents show.

Those pesky laws

Pesky laws that delegate the congressional power of creating law to unelected agencies other than Congress itself, are constitutionally illegitimate.

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by detbuch

Pesky laws that delegate the congressional power of creating law to unelected agencies other than Congress itself, are constitutionally illegitimate.

Again your argument isn’t based on on facts or current laws

It’s emotional..

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

Again your argument isn’t based on on facts or current laws

It’s emotional..

The doctrine of nondelegation is not emotional. It is based on separation of powers in constitutional governments. It is a long standing principle pre-dating our own Constitution.

Per Wikipedia:
"The doctrine of nondelegation (or non-delegation principle) is a theory that one branch of government must not authorize another entity to exercise the power or function which it is constitutionally authorized to exercise itself. It is explicit or implicit in all written constitutions that impose a strict structural separation of powers. The non-delegation doctrine stands for the principle that Congress cannot delegate its legislative powers or lawmaking ability to other entities. This prohibition typically involves Congress delegating its powers to administrative agencies or to private organizations."

It was not significantly questioned until the FDR administration appointed enough Progressive SCOTUS judges to allow a so-called "implied" power of Congress to delegate power to agencies other than Congress itself so long as Congress provides an "intelligible principle" to do so.

Well, of course, "intelligible principle" can be totally subjective, or, as you say, even emotional in derivation.

The FDR administration ravaged the Constitution, as admitted by one of FDR's Braintrust members Rex Tugwell, and basically reduced it to a matter of opinion.

There are currently suggestions that the nondelegation doctrine may be revisited in SCOTUS.

That would be nice, especially if we have enough "originalist" oriented opinions on it. I wouldn't bank on it.

But my contention is not based on "emotion." Not that emotion would not, or should not, be part of the equation.

[wdmso]

Originally Posted by detbuch

The doctrine of nondelegation is not emotional. It is based on separation of powers in constitutional governments. It is a long standing principle pre-dating our own Constitution.

Per Wikipedia:
"The doctrine of nondelegation (or non-delegation principle) is a theory that one branch of government must not authorize another entity to exercise the power or function which it is constitutionally authorized to exercise itself. It is explicit or implicit in all written constitutions that impose a strict structural separation of powers. The non-delegation doctrine stands for the principle that Congress cannot delegate its legislative powers or lawmaking ability to other entities. This prohibition typically involves Congress delegating its powers to administrative agencies or to private organizations."

It was not significantly questioned until the FDR administration appointed enough Progressive SCOTUS judges to allow a so-called "implied" power of Congress to delegate power to agencies other than Congress itself so long as Congress provides an "intelligible principle" to do so.

Well, of course, "intelligible principle" can be totally subjective, or, as you say, even emotional in derivation.

The FDR administration ravaged the Constitution, as admitted by one of FDR's Braintrust members Rex Tugwell, and basically reduced it to a matter of opinion.

There are currently suggestions that the nondelegation doctrine may be revisited in SCOTUS.

That would be nice, especially if we have enough "originalist" oriented opinions on it. I wouldn't bank on it.

But my contention is not based on "emotion." Not that emotion would not, or should not, be part of the equation.

I forgot you believe in Originalism that’s like being a flat earth believer

It’s just an excuse to avoid the truth of the reality we actually live in.

Not 13 colonies and it. 2.5 million people and but 50 states and there. 334.9 million citizens. (2023)

But we’ve had this discussion before. Let’s move on.. and i actually I would rather have this conversation in person.. because I honestly can’t compete with your writing skills. And that’s not being sarcastic.. it’s a compliment

[Rmarsh]

A day of protest against fascism. How many sackless hypocrites will be taking it to the streets? I hear that at least eight people have commited to attending......weather permiting

[detbuch]

Originally Posted by wdmso

I forgot you believe in Originalism that’s like being a flat earth believer

That's interesting. But I don't see the connection.
Could you point it out for me?

It’s just an excuse to avoid the truth of the reality we actually live in.

Whatever you envision the reality we actually live in to be, how have I lied (avoided the truth) about the nondelegation doctrine, or about the fact that creating hundreds of unelected government agencies with plenary power over the people is being fascistic? How is that all an "excuse"?

Not 13 colonies and it. 2.5 million people and but 50 states and there. 334.9 million citizens. (2023)

Did the "truth" of the nondelegation doctrine embedded in the Constitution become a lie with the addition of every new state? Or with the addition of every new citizen? Do statehood and the elements of humanity change in their basic nature as they become more numerous? Should we write a new Constitution or create a different form of government every time the population grows?

The "truth of the reality we live in" constantly changes in some way on a daily basis. One day a man is a man. The next day a man is a woman. The next day that's bunk. Is there no constant? Just total constant change? How is it possible to even have a state, a defined government, a defined human being, under such conditions?

So far, as I can see, humans have not gone through some basic evolutionary change since the time of the 13 colonies. Sure, there are the superficial surface changes in standards of living, cultural shifts, boundary changes, and so forth. But basic humanity, its physical and even metaphysical needs are pretty much the same, just different names and places. But the basic needs to be nourished, to be loved, to have fellowship, to procreate, to have family, and to have a personal amount of freedom and autonomy within a predictable, stable, society in which to flourish remain a constant.

And, as far as I can see, the original US Constitution still remains as one of the most viable governmental systems in which to achieve those basic needs.

But we’ve had this discussion before. Let’s move on..

"Let's move on" . . . to where? I hear that mantra, quite often . . . and it usually seems to be an "excuse" to escape from the "truth of the reality we live in" . . . into an undefined relief from the reality of a monotonous unbending "constitution" or other, or to justify the legal machinations of a preferred political party . . . Constitution, human nature, individual freedom, be damned . . .


and i actually I would rather have this conversation in person.. because I honestly can’t compete with your writing skills. And that’s not being sarcastic.. it’s a compliment

I mentioned, before, in the old political forum, that you had improved in your writing skills. You have taken it a notch up in those since then.

And I don't consider this a competition. That's why I hate debates where the goal is more to win than to convince and to arrive at some truth.