IG report

[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Horowitz testified today that his report “doesn’t vindicate anybody “who touched Carter Pages FISA warrants, and testified that he found “significant problem” with the FISA warrants applications.

If you believe that the Mueller report is a smoking gun, the only excuse for dismissing the IG report and his comments, is pure partisanship. Same goes for
anyone who dismissed the Mueller report as vindication but sees this as a smoking gun.

Ugly stuff. We need to take a breath and hit the reset button. In many ways, we are not in a healthy place.

So what, Trump welcomed help from a foreign power then ( hey Russia if your listening) and the pattern continues; Ukraine and hey China if your listening. So I assume you are OK with a presidential candidate or the current president seeking help to influence our elections; that is really what this is all about.
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

So what, Trump welcomed help from a foreign power then ( hey Russia if your listening) and the pattern continues; Ukraine and hey China if your listening. So I assume you are OK with a presidential candidate or the current president seeking help to influence our elections; that is really what this is all about.
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“so what” that the fbi breaks the rules when seeking to
suspend your civil rights.

this is the kind of stuff ( despotism, destroying our democratic institutions), that the left accuses trump of. but “so what”
when the fbi does it in secret.
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[Pete F.]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

“so what” that the fbi breaks the rules when seeking to
suspend your civil rights.

this is the kind of stuff ( despotism, destroying our democratic institutions), that the left accuses trump of. but “so what”
when the fbi does it in secret.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

How do you know what a report says without reading it?

Is it like this?

The FBI is lying. The IG is lying. The Ambassador is lying. The NSC is lying. The advisor to VP Pence is lying. The Special Prosecutor was lying. The women were lying. The guy saying he already built a border wall and posting his head on Sly Stallone's body is telling the truth?
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Pete F.

How do you know what a report says without reading it?

Is it like this?

The FBI is lying. The IG is lying. The Ambassador is lying. The NSC is lying. The advisor to VP Pence is lying. The Special Prosecutor was lying. The women were lying. The guy saying he already built a border wall and posting his head on Sly Stallone's body is telling the truth?
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"How do you know what a report says without reading it?"

Ummm, if you read my very short post, you'd see I based it not on the written report, but on statements made by the author of the report. Is that going too fast for you?

I didn't say anyone was lying (I mean come on, my post was a couple of sentences, how could you interpret that I claimed someone was lying?). I said that according to Horowitz, the FBI made a large number of serious and concerning errors.

Horowitz said that to the Senate today. I quoted him. That's all. Again, if you feel the need to bend over backwards like a contortionist in order to dismiss my quoting Howoritz, good for you.

[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

“so what” that the fbi breaks the rules when seeking to
suspend your civil rights.

this is the kind of stuff ( despotism, destroying our democratic institutions), that the left accuses trump of. but “so what”
when the fbi does it in secret.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

You crack me up at times. So this I assume is the only administration where issues having to do with fisa warrants have happened, give me a break; it’s been a problem forever. I’m not suggesting that isn’t a problem, but it isn’t the main problem moving forward.

Barr and his bulldog met ahead of the IG issuing the report, but guess what; they offered nothing to change their conclusions. Deep state gone. FBI and CIA coup gone. Help from a foreign power to interfere in our elections ongoing, I guess that’s no issue for you of course, as the means justify the end which is Trump has help getting elected.
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

You crack me up at times. So this I assume is the only administration where issues having to do with fisa warrants have happened, give me a break; it’s been a problem forever. I’m not suggesting that isn’t a problem, but it isn’t the main problem moving forward.

Barr and his bulldog met ahead of the IG issuing the report, but guess what; they offered nothing to change their conclusions. Deep state gone. FBI and CIA coup gone. Help from a foreign power to interfere in our elections ongoing, I guess that’s no issue for you of course, as the means justify the end which is Trump has help getting elected.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

"So this I assume is the only administration where issues having to do with fisa warrants have happened, give me a break; it’s been a problem forever'

What's your evidence of this? I'm not saying you can't be correct, but other than the fact that your statement serves your political agenda here, what is the evidence that it's true?

I also asked the question, multiple times here, of how common it is for the FBI to make a large number of serious mistakes when making FISA surveillance applications. I'm guessing neither one of us knows the answer.

But combine the errors with the fact that the target was a presidential campaign of the opposition party, and that a senior FBI agent involved claimed that "we will stop" Trump from becoming President, and it's troubling. Maybe not to Trump haters. But I'd bet every cent I own and all I could borrow that the most fervent anti Trumpers here would be signing a very different tune if Trump had made serious errors to get permission to spy on a democratic presidential campaign.

[Got Stripers]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

"So this I assume is the only administration where issues having to do with fisa warrants have happened, give me a break; it’s been a problem forever'

What's your evidence of this? I'm not saying you can't be correct, but other than the fact that your statement serves your political agenda here, what is the evidence that it's true?

I also asked the question, multiple times here, of how common it is for the FBI to make a large number of serious mistakes when making FISA surveillance applications. I'm guessing neither one of us knows the answer.

But combine the errors with the fact that the target was a presidential campaign of the opposition party, and that a senior FBI agent involved claimed that "we will stop" Trump from becoming President, and it's troubling. Maybe not to Trump haters. But I'd bet every cent I own and all I could borrow that the most fervent anti Trumpers here would be signing a very different tune if Trump had made serious errors to get permission to spy on a democratic presidential campaign.

Past fisa abuse was part of the testimony yesterday, it’s not new. Why not address the pattern of Trump soliciting help from foreign powers to interfere in our elections and it’s still today going on by Rudy and who knows what happened behind closed doors with the Russian ambassador.
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[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by Got Stripers

Past fisa abuse was part of the testimony yesterday, it’s not new. Why not address the pattern of Trump soliciting help from foreign powers to interfere in our elections and it’s still today going on by Rudy and who knows what happened behind closed doors with the Russian ambassador.
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I happen to believe we're capable of doing two things at once. Let's investigate Trump and find out if the DOJ needs some fixing. If collectively we don't like what Trump is doing, we get to vote him out in November. We can't vote out career FBI agents, so it's also important that we know what's going on there, that they aren't abusing their authority.

The DOJ said very specifically, that the Steele dossier was what "put them over the top" in terms of getting the probable cause to spy on Steele. But it was so commonly known to be garbage, that no TV network would go near it. Knowingly using false data to suspend the civil rights of an American citizen, isn't a trivial thing to most Americans.