Striper Cup 2007 - Page 2 - Striper Talk Striped Bass Fishing, Surfcasting, Boating

Swimmer · 01-12-2007, 12:04 PM

Many valid points!

Mr. Sandman · 01-12-2007, 01:00 PM

edited out to keep world peace

inTHERAPY · 01-12-2007, 01:28 PM

I will enter again next year also. In a conversation w/ Gene Bourque last night at the boat show he spoke openly about some of the proposed changes. While I do not think I am at liberty to print verbatim what i was told I can say most of "your" concerns are being addressed.
Larger minimum size fish, dedicated shore division, weighted points system per pound for shore fish, 10 truck keys, catch and release. Sign-up it's gonna be fun!

Back Beach · 01-12-2007, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Sandman

Back Beach...

Unfort'ly that is not the way it actually worked. Slips had to be turned in only once per week. Slips would get held all week and the largest fish of the week would get sent in. They were able to use the entire weeks catch and select the largest fish.

Just when I thought I was out, you pulled me back in.

If guys are doing that its not necessarily a commercial fishing issue, but an ethical one. Judging by a lot of your responses, you must have witnessed much of this first hand. I remember you making the same points during the contest and they are valid, no doubt. I'm not sure I would implicate everyone who holds a license under those auspices though. If what you are claiming is true, then the guys involved abused the system pretty badly, IMO. There's nothing that says a rec guy couldn't do the same thing though, only it would be a 14 fish per week cull instead of 95, provided both parties produced the maximum allowable take of fish. With either case,its wrong.

Canalman · 01-12-2007, 01:38 PM

My big problem with it is the hassle along with the needless killing of trophy fish. I entered... caught 8 confirmed fish over 30# let all but one go and didn't even enter that fish. I just don't care enough about it. C&R I would do but senseless killing brings us right back to 1960. I'd kinda like to see no one enter and see how they change the rules to get us back.

-Dave

inTHERAPY · 01-12-2007, 01:39 PM

[QUOTE=Mr. Sandman;450240]Back Beach...

Unfort'ly that is not the way it actually worked. Slips had to be turned in only once per week. Slips would get held all week and the largest fish of the week would get sent in. They were able to use the entire weeks catch and select the largest fish.

That is a question of ethics. Cheaters always cheat. It is not only a matter of ethics for the fisherman but also with regards to the weigh station for holding the slip and swapping it out. You speak of this happening like you know for sure. If you know of this for a fact, call them out. Tell OTW and tell us who!

Canalman · 01-12-2007, 01:40 PM

I also can't understand why anyone would enter a 20# fish? Not bashing guys who did but I just don;t get it?

Mr. Sandman · 01-12-2007, 01:41 PM

sorry

over and out!!

Back Beach · 01-12-2007, 01:47 PM

C & R would be a complete joke. With the number of unsubstantiated claims I hear every year, it would be recipe for disaster. A dead fish on the scale is the only way to truly confirm a catch, IMO. Don't even get me going on this one.

If we took all of the claims people made each year and actually confirmed them with a scale, there would be a lot of disappointed fishermen and shatterd egos.

Mike P · 01-12-2007, 02:00 PM

[QUOTE=inTHERAPY;450253]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Sandman

Back Beach...

Unfort'ly that is not the way it actually worked. Slips had to be turned in only once per week. Slips would get held all week and the largest fish of the week would get sent in. They were able to use the entire weeks catch and select the largest fish.

That is a question of ethics. Cheaters always cheat. It is not only a matter of ethics for the fisherman but also with regards to the weigh station for holding the slip and swapping it out. You speak of this happening like you know for sure. If you know of this for a fact, call them out. Tell OTW and tell us who!

There's an easy way to stop that. Either you don't allow an official weigh-in station that's also sponsoring a club to weigh its own members' fish, or you sequentially number the weigh-in slips and make the station account for all of the "missing" slips

In other words, 3 copies of every weigh-in slip, sequentially numbered. One slip to the angler, one to OTW and the weigh-in station keeps the originals. The station has to send in the originals at the end, and they're compared to the slips received by OTW.

Back Beach · 01-12-2007, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Sandman

LOL, Your post pulled me back in!!

Honestly, I think those were the rules. Slips had to go in once per week by some specific time and not submitted as soon as the fish were weighed in. That is the way I understood the rules. I could be wrong. Lord knows I have be wrong before! But IMO it really does not matter, and I really don't care one way or the other....it is the entire "being paid to fish" vs "not being paid to fish" that leaves that kind of dirty taste in my mouth. You go out and fish and spend money on fishing because you love to fish. You release fish because you love the fish. It is not the same when your on a comm boat.

over and out!!

With regard to the slips, they could be numbered and accounted for. Say a shop gets slips #1-50, and fills one out upon a weigh in, with one of the cc's going back to otw to match the original. Kind of like a p.o. What you suggested is that a guy would have a bunch of slips for the week, send the biggest in, and throw the rest away, right? Put the onus on the weigh station to account for each one of their numbered slips that are issued. When the tourney ends, OTW could call that shop and say, "what happened to slips 22-30?,they weren't returned to us but you used them." This wouldn't add any additional hassle, because the slips need to be returned anyways. They would just be numbered and accounted for.

Back Beach · 01-12-2007, 02:05 PM

[QUOTE=Mike P;450258]

Quote:

Originally Posted by inTHERAPY

There's an easy way to stop that. Either you don't allow an official weigh-in station that's also sponsoring a club to weigh its own members' fish, or you sequentially number the weigh-in slips and make the station account for all of the "missing" slips

In other words, 3 copies of every weigh-in slip, sequentially numbered. One slip to the angler, one to OTW and the weigh-in station keeps the originals. The station has to send in the originals at the end, and they're compared to the slips received by OTW.

You beat me to it, lightning boy.

Mike P · 01-12-2007, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Back Beach

With regard to the slips, they could be numbered and accounted for. Say a shop gets slips #1-50, and fills one out upon a weigh in, with one of the cc's going back to otw to match the original. Kind of like a p.o. What you suggested is that a guy would have a bunch of slips for the week, send the biggest in, and throw the rest away, right? Put the onus on the weigh station to account for each one of their numbered slips that are issued. When the tourney ends, OTW could call that shop and say, "what happened to slips 22-30?,they weren't returned to us but you used them." This wouldn't add any additional hassle, because the slips need to be returned anyways. They would just be numbered and accounted for.

Great minds think alike and at the same time

Mr. Sandman · 01-12-2007, 02:34 PM

I suppose that would work but what IF a slip was lost? This is a tackle shop you are dealing with not Arthur Anderson. IMO this entire thing it is fret with complications. I would hate being the guy having to make up the rules.

BTW, thanks for all the quotes guys..

I need to have a cup of Goose's favorite drink now and again.

beamie · 01-12-2007, 02:35 PM

Sandman,

I read you posted before you edited and agreed with some of what you stated but not all.

My thoughts......

For fairness to stop all the bickering they should just say no comm fish allowed. Though that won't stop the cheating of icing over etc.

The way I read the rules weather your a rec or comm anyone can enter 1 fish a week. Nothing that I read says you can't "cull" for the week and mail OTW your highest weight. If a rec or comm gets a 50 on Sunday and a 60 on Thursday the 60 slip goes in. Anyone can cull. Is this correct????

The only advantage the comm has over rec is he is spending way more time fishing for that 20 day period than the rec. His motivation is money, which for some or most is more than love. This gets his arse out of bed.....then double dips and weighs fish for the tourney, it is like "bycatch".....

Unfortunately, no matter what the rules, when big prizes or big egos are involved like boats and trucks no matter what the rules there will be dirty play.

Redsoxticket · 01-12-2007, 07:00 PM

The state law for MA & RI indicate the possession of a maximum of two bass over 28" per day either from shore or boat.
The commercial should follow the same rules or have their own seperate tournament and prizes within the Striper Cup.

An aside
OTW has enough subscibers and sponsors to take the lead in attempting to protect the forage of baitfish.

NIB · 01-13-2007, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Back Beach

With regard to the slips, they could be numbered and accounted for. Say a shop gets slips #1-50, and fills one out upon a weigh in, with one of the cc's going back to otw to match the original. Kind of like a p.o. What you suggested is that a guy would have a bunch of slips for the week, send the biggest in, and throw the rest away, right? Put the onus on the weigh station to account for each one of their numbered slips that are issued. When the tourney ends, OTW could call that shop and say, "what happened to slips 22-30?,they weren't returned to us but you used them." This wouldn't add any additional hassle, because the slips need to be returned anyways. They would just be numbered and accounted for.

There are ways around everything..
If a shop was sponsering so to say,a team..
They could just write the weights down an tally em up at the end of the week.Sign a blank slip..to be filled out later.??
The only way to really assure is to have the slips be post marked 24 hrs after being weighed..That would have to be the entrants responsibility..
Of course on weekends that might be a problem..

Moses · 01-27-2007, 06:33 AM

In the Feb 07 OTW magazine, there is an ad for Striper Cup 2007. Notable statements on this ad include;

1. "This years tournament will feature a new surf-casters division!"

2. "NEW FOR 07: Catch & Release Option"

Of course, more details to follow but this sounds promising.

JohnR · 01-27-2007, 09:04 AM

Oooo - Catch & release option? Wonder how that will work out.

I know I must split with many of my brothas (and probably piss a few off) but I think commercial season should somehow disabled for commercial license holders. Some say that there is no motivation or advantage - other than skill - but that is just not true. I'm perfectly fine with getting my ass handed to me by a superior commercial angler based on skill. The whole numerical advantage in how many bass a comm angler can posess during the same amount of time is tremendous....

Kudos for a surf division

BigFish · 01-27-2007, 09:10 AM

I can't worry about those who WILL cheat! I just take care of my own and they are the ones who have to live with themselves! Someone got caught with their hand in the cookie jar last yar as I recall! See ya!

No pride or self respect in cheating!

Zeno · 01-27-2007, 09:44 AM

Is anyone surprised that was a single club or an entrant from NY?Considering that the clubs as far as southern NJ participated ,its kind of odd.You cant say people in NY don't read OTW as everyone I know is a reader if not subscribers (granted ,I move in surf and not boat circles)

CowHunter · 01-27-2007, 11:20 AM

Funny how many guys are complaining about the Commercial Guys. I dont see what the big deal is, theyve only got a 5 week season?? 4 days a week and most don't bother fishing Sundays... Theres the whole month of May, June, Half of July, Half of August, September, and October where guys can way in one fish a week... Ill have to start my own club for this tournament!

CowHunter · 01-27-2007, 11:23 AM

I did have a few clients of mine that were fishing this tournament this past year, I know one of them one biggest fish in August w/ a 50.6lbs, Came down to the last two for the truck key! Some nice fish were wieghed in off my boat in the adult a junior divisions.....I Never entered.

Swimmer · 01-27-2007, 11:57 AM

I agree with John about the commercial fisherman advantage from a numbers standpoint. However, I believe thier greatest advantage is from another perspective, and that is the knowledge they have of where the fish are located on a day to day basis, not only as it relates the size of a school of fish that is being fished by the com guys, but the size of the fish taken as well. Very few chat up each other, but thier are certain people who let other certain people know where they are catching, because they are buddies on and off the water. Some boats while they dont share profit do fish in tandem, and watch out for each other in many many other ways.
Some of the guys I know that fish commercially could care less about a tournament, and do not enter any.

NIB · 01-28-2007, 09:29 AM

I really don't understand the why guys in boats do not want to fish against the com guys..
Look at it this way u still have a 2 fish per day limit..
u know to even get a mention ur gonna have to get one in the mid forties..
So u get one 46 lbs it goes in the cooler.an u fish for a bigger one..
U should all be ashamed of urselves as MEN..
I hear these cry's of time on the water an amount of fish it all means crap.'
Do u wanna beat the best to be the best or do u wanna play on some kinda fishing for the time impaired/skill level impaired curve..
.

Here is a god example for u cry baby's look at kenny Cow Hunter..
Surf guy for a few yrs has lots of drive gets a boat spends lots of time honin his craft an the guy consistantly gets big fish..
All in the time frame of a few yrs really..
He's from NJ.Thats why he's good..

It ain't a spot thing it's technique..
He can fish with most anyone in the waters that stripers swim..
Suck it up..

NIB · 01-28-2007, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeno

Is anyone surprised that was a single club or an entrant from NY?Considering that the clubs as far as southern NJ participated ,its kind of odd.You cant say people in NY don't read OTW as everyone I know is a reader if not subscribers (granted ,I move in surf and not boat circles)

I didn't think those dudes could read..

So what R u saying.
Why didn't they enter..
Them LI surf contest's get plenty of play..

NIB · 01-28-2007, 09:36 AM

Catch an Release is a joke in a tourney worth anything..
Nice concept but fisherman are liars to begin with.
Giving out prizes for fish tales won't cut it in NIB's world..

Ake G · 01-28-2007, 09:47 AM

I'm not and would never be interested in participating in or supporting any tournament or organization that encourages fish kills.

I think it's irresponsible and hypocritical of On The Water magazine to stage or support this tournament at all.

Back Beach · 01-28-2007, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NIB

Catch an Release is a joke in a tourney worth anything..
Nice concept but fisherman are liars to begin with.
Giving out prizes for fish tales won't cut it in NIB's world..

Agreed 100%.In Back Beach's world its the same "weigh", pun intended.

I think the fairy tale division would bring more people in, which is good because it is a sportsmanship event, after all. Lots of good, honest anglers out there that catch and release too.

I would presume the awards would have to be lesser for unoffically weighed fish, though.No trucks or boats, maybe a plaque,boga grip, and some barbless hooks.

Its good in theory and a conservation minded gesture.The potential abuses are exponentially greater than the non catch and release divisions though if large prizes are offered.If the C&R is its own divison though, there is no reason to oppose it. Its a good idea.

tattoobob · 01-28-2007, 11:18 AM

I am thinking this over and I may just join the end of year party was fun I saw alot of people there that I didn't see all year, and I am not in it for the win just the fun. I only keep what I am going to feed the family. That is probably 3 or 4 in the 15 to 20 pound range