MSBA Action Alert--Stripers Forever Bill Could Pass- Only One Hearing--This Thursday - Page 4 - Striper Talk Striped Bass Fishing, Surfcasting, Boating

Redsoxticket · 01-14-2010, 06:26 PM

What were the final conclusions of the hearing ?

PRBuzz · 01-14-2010, 06:51 PM

My guess: everyone had so much fun today that they are going to go away and study the issue some more..........

zimmy · 01-14-2010, 07:05 PM

Is there some reason I am missing that makes it a comm. vs. rec issue? Shouldn't this discussion be about how many fish are being killed? I don't care who the frig is taken em. Dead fish is dead fish.

CowHunter · 01-14-2010, 07:07 PM

Its a tough one to study... Comms kill 10%, Recs kill 90%... And SF is Blaming the Mass Coms...

JohnR · 01-14-2010, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CowHunter

Its a tough one to study... Comms kill 10%, Recs kill 90%... And SF is Blaming the Mass Coms...

The other part of the argument is that the recs represent 99.99% of the anglers and generate 90% of the economic impact.

CowHunter · 01-14-2010, 08:44 PM

So you take out the comms , give the rec guys a bonus tag allotment, (Commercial quota 1.1 mil lbs) for an extra fish and you will have a healthy striped bass stock I take.... Who will you have to blame then???? I guess the 10% economic impact doesnt mean anything so just throw it out only rec guys should kill fish....

CowHunter · 01-14-2010, 09:30 PM

Trying to understand this economic impact.... If I take my clients out on a charter and the limit is 2 fish per man at 28", that will equate to 10 dead bass a trip...Now lets say you got the bonus tag like you do here in NJ its 15.... Im no mathmetician but if it were a 1 fish limit per man than thats 5 dead bass and results in far fewer fish killed recreationally and overall. The economic impact stays the same if they kill 5, 10, or 15 fish on a trip???? The more they kill the more thats given away to nieghbors or frozen and forgoten...
A 1 fish limit would reduce a 10 million pound catch to probably around 5 million.
Look, almost everybody I know that charters, or fishes recreationally KILLS their limit. The response I get is, "The law says I can kill two so Im Killing two"

numbskull · 01-14-2010, 09:34 PM

Relax........Pew plans to sort this all out for us. Enjoy.

zimmy · 01-14-2010, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnR

The other part of the argument is that the recs represent 99.99% of the anglers and generate 90% of the economic impact.

I understand that...to some extent. However, I am not convinced that I should be able to keep a bass every day I fish, but someone else who doesn't fish can't go to a nice restaurant and get a bass fillet during a limited season. It is all about total numbers to me. Economic impact wise, having a healthy fish population is what is needed to keep recs fishing. Even if I could never keep a bass, I would still fish. Not the case for the commercial guys.

Stuff needs to be fixed, but cutting the commercials out doesn't seem to be necessary to me, but I am open to all points on this. I would actually be much happier to have a limited commercial season and not allow recs to keep fish over 40".

sokinwet · 01-14-2010, 10:23 PM

"I would still fish. Not the case for the commercial guys. "

I don't agree. Most every commercial guy I know fishes before, during and after the commercial season.

Raider Ronnie · 01-14-2010, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAKAI

Most of my charter capt friends this time of year are sleeping to 11 and getting fatter.
Piss me off with jealosy.

I highly doubt the "sleeping till 11" statement !

BasicPatrick · 01-14-2010, 11:32 PM

A big thanks to all that came out to the State House for the public hearing today. Anyone that attended clearly saw that there is overwhelming public opposition to the legislation. The Stripers Forever advocates could not even answer basic questions from committee members and pretty much imploded when asked to justify/defend their proposals. They had their chance to make their case and failed miserably.

Although some forces wish to use this legislation to fire up a feud between the Rod & Reel Commercial Fleet and the Recreational Fishing Community, MSBA will not allow that to interfere with ongoing political unity and actions that can truely make a difference and bring improvement to some issues we all know exist. For example, it is only when acting as one community can we make progress in the campaign to bring change to the Atlantic Herring Fishery (especially the rape of our local waters by Mid Water Trawl and Pair Trawl Gear) or make sure that the next round of Striped Bass Management actions at the Atlantic States Marine Fisheries Commission adresses known issues. Together We Can!!!

A big thanks to the following organizations for turning out members and participating in today's actions:

Cape Cod Charter Boat Assn.
Cape Cod Commercial Hook Fisherman's Assn
Cape Cod Salties
MA Beach Buggy Assn
MV/Chilmark/Dukes County Fishing Group
New Bedford/Marion Fishing Group
North East Charter Boat Assn
RFA MA
Stellwagen Bank Charter Captains Assn
(If we missed anyone, we apologize)

MAKAI · 01-15-2010, 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raider Ronnie

I highly doubt the "sleeping till 11" statement !

You don't know my friends Ron.
If I pop in on them when I 'm in the area this time of year
They are still in their slippers at lunch.

Hell I know lots of guys out of work who see no need to get up early, just killing time hoping something breaks. I am lucky that I have more work than I can handle. Or I might be doing the same thing.
Are you taking charters out of Boston in January ? Because that's my point I was poking fun at my pals, it was meant as a joke.

intrepid24 · 01-15-2010, 04:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nebe

Boy it sure would be a shame if striped bass became a protected game fish. What a tragedy.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

indeed.

trapperpierre · 01-15-2010, 09:24 AM

......and, I know the drill: people forget I spent 7 years on the ASMFC SB Advisory Panel-when I made a strong statement(based on scientific& reliable anecdotal fisherman observation) for the betterment of the resource--I was not reappointed by the Governor...so it goes..(and..at times I miss fly'n down to Wash DC, the 5 star hotel accomodations, 1 liter bottle of Fuji water on the dresser, and the 3 lbs. lobster dinners lol)
...........I thank you all for computer reports on the hearing along with Kenny's text messages(would have attended-but the flu bug found me..)
...............responsible multiple use of natural resources is the only way to go............................................

maddmatt · 01-15-2010, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zimmy

Is there some reason I am missing that makes it a comm. vs. rec issue? Shouldn't this discussion be about how many fish are being killed? I don't care who the frig is taken em. Dead fish is dead fish.

exactly

this is all about divide and conquer

peta's laughing all the way to their next law suit

i wouldn't doubt it if they have ties or made contributions to stripers for ever.

maddmatt · 01-15-2010, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sokinwet

"I would still fish. Not the case for the commercial guys. "

I don't agree. Most every commercial guy I know fishes before, during and after the commercial season.

true that

JohnnyD · 01-15-2010, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CowHunter

Yes, let's make it a Gamefish, just like it is in NJ right??
Stripersforever wants to make it a gamefish but let's recreational guys keep a slot fish... Selfish, no??? Hypocrits???

From what I hear the meeting is still going, over 3 hours.... Heard it's pretty good... Guess StripersForever weren't welcome in open arms....
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Gamefish status coast-wide. 1/day @ 36"+. Every fish gets at least a few years to spawn diversifying the gene pool, no one needs more than that for family consumption.

Like many have said before, unless you're a commercial fisherman, why would you want anything less than Gamefish status?

BasicPatrick · 01-15-2010, 12:15 PM

Today they aregue that gamefish status means 1 fish at whatever sixe limit...a short time after that goes into effect they come back and say gamefish status means no take catch and release only...that is the play book....this is proven and our defense is responsible tru peer reviewed science based management

CowHunter · 01-15-2010, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyD

Gamefish status coast-wide. 1/day @ 36"+. Every fish gets at least a few years to spawn diversifying the gene pool, no one needs more than that for family consumption.

Like many have said before, unless you're a commercial fisherman, why would you want anything less than Gamefish status?

Your speaking for a small surfcasting group and the majority of flyrodders.... I like the 36" limit, 1 fish, said it before. But how is that fair to the com guys.... Its still a fish, doesnt make it right for the recs to harvest them but not the coms.... Kind of a double standard??? You want a Gamefish, but want to be allowed to kill fish too???

JohnnyD · 01-15-2010, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BasicPatrick

Today they aregue that gamefish status means 1 fish at whatever sixe limit...a short time after that goes into effect they come back and say gamefish status means no take catch and release only...that is the play book....this is proven and our defense is responsible tru peer reviewed science based management

Even better.

JohnnyD · 01-15-2010, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CowHunter

Your speaking for a small surfcasting group and the majority of flyrodders.... I like the 36" limit, 1 fish, said it before. But how is that fair to the com guys.... Its still a fish, doesnt make it right for the recs to harvest them but not the coms.... Kind of a double standard??? You want a Gamefish, but want to be allowed to kill fish too???

You're forgetting that it's not what I want, it's what is best for the fish. The situation that would be absolutely best for the fish is no take at all, and if that happens eventually, all the better. I very rarely keep bass anyway. Unless you're a meat fisherman (commercial or rec.), there is no reason not to support gamefish status.

You're misdirected if you think regulation is about fairness.

CowHunter · 01-15-2010, 12:54 PM

I know you want whats best for the fish, so do I, as do all I would hope.... Im not arguing that... The problem is your with a very small group if fishermen that want a catch and release fishery for themselves. define Gamefish for me please? New jeresy is a Gamefish State, So you dont have a problem with me killing 12,000 lbs on my charters in May and June, but you have a problem with me killing 11,500 lbs in mass July and august because Im killing them and then selling them???

Just because you RARELY Keep a bass doesnt mean others should.... I happen to eat Bass regularly, so does my family, whats wrong with that??? You want to have people dictate what your allowed to eat or not?

Its a shared resource that needs to be shared, and managed properly...

Your in the Group that thinks Recs should take a 100% of the Catch, how is that right?? You see what a small group you represent clearly on the showing for stripers forever yesterday... How may members do they have???

JohnnyD · 01-15-2010, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CowHunter

I know you want whats best for the fish, so do I, as do all I would hope.... Im not arguing that... The problem is your with a very small group if fishermen that want a catch and release fishery for themselves. define Gamefish for me please? New jeresy is a Gamefish State, So you dont have a problem with me killing 12,000 lbs on my charters in May and June, but you have a problem with me killing 11,500 lbs in mass July and august because Im killing them and then selling them???

Game fish status as I understand it is no commercial take and severely limited Rec take. If "Jersey Shore" on MTV has taught us anything, it's that NJ shouldn't be taken as the rule with regards to anything.

Quote:

Just because you RARELY Keep a bass doesnt mean others should.... I happen to eat Bass regularly, so does my family, whats wrong with that??? You want to have people dictate what your allowed to eat or not?

There is a lot wrong with it, if you have read recent reports concerning mercury and PCP content in Striped Bass. As Makia stated, some studies have shown that women and children shouldn't eat *any* striped bass.

Quote:

Its a shared resource that needs to be shared, and managed properly...

Exactly. And the most effective way to properly manage it is to drastically limit how many fish can be taken. The tons of juvenile SB being netted in the Chesapeake isn't doing anyone any favors, nor is 2 fish @ 28" for Recs or 30 fish/day and 5 on Sundays for Comms.

Let's lay it all out there. You're a commercial guy and you run charters. Legislation like this would certainly take money out of your pocket and many others. Nothing about this legislation is beneficial to you. You are also in a drastic minority and you're right, it's not fair. On the other hand, there is no way you can argue that no Commercial take and 1 fish/day @ 36" for everyone is not in the best interest of the Striped Bass. You'd still be able to eat striped bass for dinner with your family and no one is telling you what you can and can't eat.

CowHunter · 01-15-2010, 02:08 PM

Jersey Shore, I heard some simple minds were entertained by it, dont know, because I have better things to do than waste my time and watch an episode... But Hey, thats just me..

Severely limit the rec take??? I like the one at 36", but killing 5 million pounds vs 10 million pounds is severe??

I really dont think what people eat is of mine, nor your concern... Theres alot of stuff thats bad for you.... Been eating striped bass quite often for 22 years or so, last I looked Im still here and healthy... Besides, You can always sue the state that allows sale if you get cancer or something...

Nothing in the legislature is benificial to me? THE HEALTH OF THE STRIPED BASS POPULATION IS BENIFICAL TO ME....I do care about a healthy striped bass stock, and I am well aware of what goes up and down the coast. Im all for the cuts, but to wipe out and blame striped bass commercial pinhookers for what ANYBODY that kills a striped bass is guilty of is wrong...

As a commercial guy I dont see a 10% catch as wrong... As a Charter guy I m saying we kill more fish than need be recreationally. Im saying that we dont need to kill 2-3 fish a man... Coming in with 15 dead bass on a charter is a bit overkill, I know alot of that meat will be wasted or given away to people that dont appreciate it...

Am I that wrong??? I mean hello, only .5% supported StripersForever...

CowHunter · 01-15-2010, 02:25 PM

Striped Bass fishing is getting tougher, people want somebody to blame... A group like stripersforever and other individuals seesmass commercial fishermen kill 1.1 million pounds of fish, 30 fish a day! They say Ha! That is the problem!!! Turn a blind eye to what the real number recreational catches are... I assure you, they are STAGGERING... well above what people think.... The only thing we are in agreement on JohnnyD is 1 fish @ 36".... Im against the new regs charter guys are pushing in NJ, a slot fish 24-27.99"... I know the damage that it does and they are trying to make limiting out in the early spring and fall runs easier for them... Im all for giving the fish a break....

intrepid24 · 01-15-2010, 02:48 PM

"whats best for the fish"
a very strange concept, as both recs and comms are debating the best way to kill them.
hey, whats best for the fish is no one allowed to kill them at all !!
however both sides love fishing for sb, and need to unify in order to save their enviornment/forage......us being divided is also bad for sb,
this division is shortsighted.

CowHunter · 01-15-2010, 02:51 PM

Intrepid24, My biggest problem is they want the Striped bass a Gamefish, BUTTTTTT They want to be allowed to kill one for the table... They want to go from Harvesting 90% to Harvesting 100%????

JohnnyD · 01-15-2010, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CowHunter

As a commercial guy I dont see a 10% catch as wrong... As a Charter guy I m saying we kill more fish than need be recreationally. Im saying that we dont need to kill 2-3 fish a man... Coming in with 15 dead bass on a charter is a bit overkill, I know alot of that meat will be wasted or given away to people that dont appreciate it...

If you're so against coming in with 15 dead bass per charter and know that a lot of the fish will go to waste, then maybe you should stop doing charters. According to you, you can catch big fish whenever you want to - you've posted your slips. So, you're part of the problem.

You're trying to play both sides of the coin and it doesn't work like that. It also makes it impossible to take you seriously when you talk at all about conservation. Either you fish commercially and run charters allowing people to take their max keep, or you're think killing that many fish is wrong with a lot of it going to waste and you stop doing charters. Sometimes you argue for both positions in the same post and are continually contradiction yourself.

Pick a side.

CowHunter · 01-15-2010, 03:40 PM

Maybe I'm BiPolar???? So let me see i have to choose only one????

a) I am a surfcaster fishing for fun, releasing my fish, what I am happiest doing for me, and only me... Its my time and what I love most...

b) I am a commercial rod and reel pinhooker...

c) I am a charter Captain, putting clients on to fish, I may not agree with the regs, but the law says 2 fish @ 28", plus bonus tag in NJ and its what my clients want...

d) I am a tournament fisherman, enjoy the challenge, new places to fish, and a shot to win some $$$...

So according to you JohnnyD, I can only pick one of the above... I have to pick a side as you say..... Yes its one vs the other.... Geez I am sure I am the only one in this situation???

FYI, I posted a slip for everyone that is crying how the fishing used to be, how there are no fish..... Im sorry but sometimes we have to work for them... You understand we cant have a slaughter everytime we go out, wheres the challenge.... And no I dont claim to catch big fish everywhere. I fish for striped bass from NC to Maine, both boat, and surf... I have yet to break the 50lb mark in every state, but yes, one day I will have a 50 from every state I fish for my trophy room. That is my personal Goal. So I got a few states covered thus far. We all have personal goals..Is that so bad??

Im sorry you have such Hatred for Commercial Bass fishermen...