lures vs. bait

[Sgt Striper]

Originally Posted by BigFish

There you go Slow Eddie! Its all about the experience for me....not always about the results! I do well enough to stick with what I enjoy! Building lures and crushing fish on them is a high I will never tired of!!!

Could not agree more!

and Poncho, lighten up! George be funnin'

[spinncognito]

Bait, especially live does indeed making catching easier.

There is a particular area that myself and a few friends fish often with plugs only. Leading up to commercial season we were getting a few fish on top with pencils and metal lipped swimmers.

As soon as commercial season started there were six boats in the exact area, well within casting range using live pogies and/or macs. Every morning they cleaned up, bagging multiple 30 and 40 pound fish right in front of eyes. Point being that those fish were there the whole time but not being easily fooled by our artificials. Now that comm season is over we are back to catching a few good fish per week.

[East Tide]

EELS = live lures.

Fun to fish, easy to keep alive and big time producers. I have more confidence fishing live eels than anything else.

Not to say I don't fish other stuff when the time is right.

[Swimmer]

Two years ago in the ditch I caught a dozen fish over thirty on plugs, and that doesn't include the biggest one. Countless numbers in the 20's, but when I go to the Vineyard I do both. Especially at night, sitting in the big chair, with a beer on one side, snappes on the other, and a smile on the guy fishing.

[DZ]

Originally Posted by numbskull

Yup.
Bait is for when you are learning to catch large fish and plugs for when you know how to catch large fish.
A time and place for everything.

Eels, of course, are for those who are really bad learners.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Poor Alan. He can't catch a break fishing with Numby. I love their banter at each other. They both stopped at the Salt Water Edge shop last Saturday while I was there working. George, as always, riding Alan about cheating with eels. But Alan and I got the last rib at George when we noticed he was taking steps toward the dark side of eel fishing when he purchased "Smelly Jelly" to smear on his plugs. Probably eel scented. Was great to see you guys!

DZ

[JoeBass]

The last 2 weeks I fished thawed bait, fresh bait, live lined macs, threw rubber baits and fly fished. Caught them on everything and enjoyed it all. Actually only got one briefly on the fly and lost it. But that was a blast too!

[BigFish]

I know Sauerkraut loves to fish the "Prey" and from what I can recall his biggest fish the last year or so may have come on it??? Regardless he ain't just ch#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&' slimey's!!! LOL!!

[the point]

eels even considered bait??? because I'm mostly a plug/ eels user. With the occasional use of bait if there are pogies around to snag or macs to grab for live lining.. But like what has been said already, Different times and places aquire different types of fishing methods. What wont work one place will kill em in another.

[rizzo]

As far as large fish go - Plugs are getting rage lately because there been so much big bait around esp. in the canal and they work well there. I've broken 40lbs on a plug but it was under a specific set of conditions that happens 5% of the time. The other 95% is eel fishing.

Eels are king for 2 reasons. Deadly on giant bass and you have the single hook factor. You hook the fish on an eel your percentages are very high for landing that fish. Lots can go wrong with plugs.

[nightfighter]

I thoroughly enjoy fishing plugs, especially topwater, and now my own creations. Not the same plugging from my boat as it is from the surf though.... That said, I have a boat, and with the plentiful availability of pogies now, and macks earlier in the season, I can't resist tossing them into some deeper holes to see how big I can catch. Yes, it is different. But the vicious hits and ensuing battles I have had the pleasure of experiencing lately are due to offerings of fresh cut pogies. They are actually outfishing live macks and live pogies. Also think the fish have been jazzed up due to the comms chunking thoughout their season. I got a few fish yesterday on plugs and rubber after running out of pogies, but all were substantially smaller.
It has been a strange season. The big fish are here. Could be gone in a flash, so will continue getting bait as my first option, at least from my boat. I do like catching as opposed to not catching.

[tysdad115]

Originally Posted by BigFish

I know Sauerkraut loves to fish the "Prey" and from what I can recall his biggest fish the last year or so may have come on it??? Regardless he ain't just ch#^&#^&#^&#^&#^&' slimey's!!! LOL!!

I know a kid that does pretty good on them as well...

[BigFish]

So he is religious...and he "Preys"???

[ProfessorM]

Originally Posted by Poncho

A very dumb statment from a very smart man. numbskull we have a mutal friend from this site who tells me you are a smart man and a good fisherman but I highly disagree with your statment

I disagree too but don't listen to Alan he is jealous of Numby's plug prowess.

Now that I have defended your honor take me plugging so I can remember what it is like to catch a fish on something other than bait.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[numbskull]

Originally Posted by Poncho

A very dumb statment from a very smart man. numbskull we have a mutal friend from this site who tells me you are a smart man and a good fisherman but I highly disagree with your statment

Sadly, I'm not as smart as I was yesterday, nor as dumb as I'll be tomorrow, so when it comes to eels it is best not to take me too seriously.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[Van]

What is this plug thing of which you speak?


Same answear I give year after year on similar posts.

[piemma]

Originally Posted by fishbones

There's a time and a place for both, depending on conditions.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Bingo!!!!

[Poncho]

Originally Posted by Sgt Striper

Could not agree more!

and Poncho, lighten up! George be funnin'

My bad perhaps that was a bit harsh I apologize, could have presented my position a bit more tactfully, or tried to read between the lines and recognized the eel/plug banter, won't happen again.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

[Ed B]

A good friend of mine who has been a very good and successful big fish catcher for many decades has an expression which i really like. He says "Big fish don't chase". While that is a generalization and doesn't explain every possible circumstance or big fish that has ever been caught, his statement is valid. To increase your odds, presentation of the right lures in the right place and manner is key to big fish of all species, and that is the fun of artificials made of wood, plastic, rubber, fur or feathers.

Now, if I were told I had to bring home a big fish or the family would go hungry, I'd fish an eel. But if I were out to have fun for myself, I'd be looking for a current seam or edge to slowly work a plug and dropper combo. And I would not be surprised if my biggest fish came on a properly presented dropper.


Ed

[Sgt Striper]

Originally Posted by Ed B

A good friend of mine who has been a very good and successful big fish catcher for many decades has an expression which i really like. He says "Big fish don't chase". While that is a generalization and doesn't explain every possible circumstance or big fish that has ever been caught, his statement is valid. To increase your odds, presentation of the right lures in the right place and manner is key to big fish of all species, and that is the fun of artificials made of wood, plastic, rubber, fur or feathers.




Ed

Your friend is absolutely right! A big and slowly retrieved plug will catch big fish! Jack Frech's most productive/large fish plug was the Banana...A large plug that he fished at a crawl.

[BigFish]

Rule #1: If you are fishing plugs and you are not varying your retrieve speed........stick to bait! I see so many guys tossing plugs and think that ripping them in is the only way to fish them.......my best action comes when working almost any plug slowly!

[justplugit]

I like to fish clams when the wind would blow the doors off the truck or
with my Grandsons. Did get my PB on an eel though.
But to me there is nothing better than walking down the beach casting
wood or plastic.

[robc22]

Catching bait is an art in it's own right.knowing where to find bait on a regular basis, Throwing a cast net, setting eel pots so they catch, raking sand eels, rigging a live tank, etc are all part of a true bait fisherman's skill level. A fisherman who makes his own plugs is the only angler somewhat comparable skillwise to a true bait man........

[LINESIDES]

Originally Posted by robc22

Catching bait is an art in it's own right.knowing where to find bait on a regular basis, Throwing a cast net, setting eel pots so they catch, raking sand eels, rigging a live tank, etc are all part of a true bait fisherman's skill level. A fisherman who makes his own plugs is the only angler somewhat comparable skillwise to a true bait man........

RIGHT ON THE MONEY!!

Great subject!
This falls into five major categories in my opinion.
1, Opinions.
2, Day or night
3, Location.
4, Right time.
5, Also what they are feeding on at that moment!
I don’t usually chime in on many things however I like this one.
Use the actual bait or match the bait the best you can with color and size.
Use what the other guy is using if he is killing them.
If you are alone it falls back to category one.
So many things to try and not enough time in life to try them all.
I have seen large fish taken on most everything you can throw at them at a given time when they are feeding.
I was brought up on worms. This was when you could buy a flat of worms (12 dozen) for under $12.00.
Graduated to eels. Got into trapping my own.
When Blue fish started showing up we would go out with as much as 60 eels in a night.
Then I moved on to wood.
I think when taking the quality in size & weight the two best bets falls into the eels and wood division.
I do care if catch the world record!!
I have spent the last thirty years fishing for the one.
I have spent five to six days a week until I collapse for duration of three months while I have known up river I could be catching 30 or 40 pound Stripers for the chance to land the right one. I may add that spending all this time not even getting a bump in three months.
After reading that last statement your thought is this guy does not know what he is doing.
The fact is I do! I am just dedicated to my bucket list quest.
I just started my list early in life.
For me fishing wood and wire at night is an art unto itself.
It also produces larger fish in my opinion. ( First category!)
Fishing wood and wire does not whip the fish as bad as spinning equipment.
It also makes for healthier releases.
Every time I go out is like going out for the first time in my life.
I have seen this beautiful seductive fish cause marriage brake ups and divorces as men get caught up in this great sport.
As I get to my prime time in life of my quest I have been asking myself this for the last few years.
If I do it, what should I do with the fish when I get it.
I release all my fish these days.
I am more than likely the only dope that is actually prepared in detail to take this fish home with me.
Remember this bigger the fish the lazier they are.
They prefer slow easy water and eating!!!
I am sure I know a couple of folks here would agree with me.
If I have bored you folks with this I sincerely apologize!

[Joe L]

I do both. There are times when I just like to sit in a beach chair, bait out, rod in a sandspike and watch and kick back. Times when I have to keep moving, plugging.
I guess I fish to relax and can find relaxation in both methods.

[ProfessorM]

I do what I like and that includes both. Never felt bad fishing either way and enjoy the challenges of both..

[Notaro]

It depends on the time of the month/season. Early season, I stick with the lures and chunk in the late season, but I am more of jig and plug person because I frequent to the canal more than any beaches or breachways. I find fish by jigging and plugging as long as I match the hatch.

[fcap60]

I consistently take more and bigger fish with eels.
I enjoy fishing plugs, but tend not to get "locked in", so when the fish don't wan't plugs, I'll switch to eels.

the one execption for me is sluggos, I fiind them to produce more than "hard plugs"

[Justfishin']

What ever helps me to relax more.
For me, it's being there, catching or not.
Caught big, caught small on both, but plugs do take less clean up and since I make most of my own it works out a little cheaper. To qualify it though- when I'm on the rocks, I use plugs 90% of the time. When I'm fishing holes and bars on the sand, I'm with Swimmer, great way to relax.

[Rob Rockcrawler]

The best fishermen i know are well rounded they fish what the fish want under certain conditions. A guy that i fish with regularly fished plugs about 33% of the time eels about 34% of the time and chunks the rest. HE has a couple spots that he has fished for many many years and knows when to use bait. I fished the spot a few weeks ago and nailed ONE nice fish on eel. HE said that eels would be working but i should concentrate on chunking scup during the tide stage i was fishing. HE went the next night and got 4 fish in the mid 30-42 pound range. HE didnt bring a plug or an eel with him, his game plan was to go chunking for big fish and it worked.

[Zeal]

Wow it has been too long! Missed everyone!

Yes, now then...

Even though I'm only a kid (24 years old) I fished since I had motor skills. Most of my life was on a boat until about 8 years ago where my godfather moved and took the boat with him. Surfcasting is my new world to explore (miss being spoiled with a boat though!).

However, the man I fished with constantly bailed fish (talk about a self-esteem killer growing up when the ratio was 5-10:1 fish per trip with him being the 5-10).

Frankly, he caught or bought bait, and what he did was deadstick the bait rod on one side of the boat and plug on the other side every drift. He's had plenty of times where he had both lines tight and had to hurry up to get to the other rod (Or he would plug while I was using the bait rod to learn how to properly fight the fish, set the hook, bait my hook, etc.)

The bait kept the bottom of the water column in check while he used the plugs to check the middle and upper columns. Funny though, he always called it practice when he plugged even though he has been doing it for 50+ years. If you caught a fish, great, but you still need practice. Typically he used a topwater more than anything. Sinking poppers, Spooks. The only middle I have seen on the boat always were storm shads with the tails nipped off.

The only time he live-lined was when I would be with him and that would be with eels (which produced just as much as clam believe it or not). He only live-lined when he saw fit (which was the time before it was illegal to catch Porgies and live-line them).

However, now that I am a rookie surfcaster with only a few seasons under my belt, I have only had real success plugging or bucktailing. Bait doesn't go over well with me and I don't have the luxury of time to go many times in a week before it goes bad. I used to catch spearing to get weakfish/squeteague when they felt like coming around with a seine net. If there were no fish to be caught with the net, it was a waste of time. If there were a little, slow day. (That was pre-surfcasting days)

But just looking at the bait swim in the bucket or even when live-lined taught me more than anything. What they look like when calm, panicked, hurt, how they react to getting attacked, etc.

Applying the knowledge that I acquired being spoiled with the boat but also an amazing teacher, I have seen it all 20+ years of fishing plugging and baitfishing at a near deadlock. Both produced fish of all sizes, if anything, the only difference is that bait costs money and can be used for a limited time!

It all comes down to the time, place, and knowing when to hold and when to fold and knowing your spots. I've been on party boats where the people who fish everyday of their lives of retirement or for a fishing forecast magazine eat the 50.00 dollars and just sit in the cabin for half the day because jigging wasn't cutting it and no bait was around. If you are having a slow enough day and the bait will give you only one fish instead of a goose egg, that is negligible in my eyes since you just spent hours of your time, money on gas and bait, and effort watching a pole sit there (Of course the only exception making the fish a trophy which some people live for).

But to me, I'd much rather have a day filled with throwbacks than one trophy and being bored the rest of the day.

Being without a boat, it feels unnatural to me using bait since it sits in only one place on a beach or inlet. I can cover way more ground with plugs and my surf rod with bait on it just never worked out (Skates piss me off too much and if I'm going to need a beach chair, that means I'm going in the water to surf).

The usage of bait and plugs are twofold for me at least: just is a matter of statistics which shows us what is working and also what we learn from doing both. Bait only takes you so far, plugging, there is always something to learn.

My 2 cents, which I hope isn't BS or put everyone to sleep.

P.S - I seem to remember seeing a video posted around here where a fisherman experimented this idea where he used Eels and then used only plugs and the result was that he caught just as many fish on plugs as eels. Can't remember who posted it or where it is now though.