Striper Talk Striped Bass Fishing, Surfcasting, Boating

     

Left Nav S-B Home FAQ Members List S-B on Facebook Arcade WEAX Tides Buoys Calendar Today's Posts Right Nav

Left Container Right Container
 

Go Back   Striper Talk Striped Bass Fishing, Surfcasting, Boating » Striper Chat - Discuss stuff other than fishing ~ The Scuppers and Political talk » Grumpy Old Pharts Board

Grumpy Old Pharts Board Gerritol, Ex-Lax, Immodium, Bad Breath - all requirements for the Grumpy Board

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 08-26-2021, 03:04 PM   #91
PaulS
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
PaulS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 10,242
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman View Post
If it prevents you from getting sick, why are you worried that an unvaccinated person will infect you. You’re vaccinated, no worries
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
I'm not sure if you realize that I can still get the virus
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
PaulS is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2021, 03:56 PM   #92
spence
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
spence's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulS View Post
I'm not sure if you realize that I can still get the virus
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
And pass it to others.
spence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2021, 03:57 PM   #93
The Dad Fisherman
Super Moderator
iTrader: (0)
 
The Dad Fisherman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Georgetown MA
Posts: 18,189
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulS View Post
I'm not sure if you realize that I can still get the virus
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Well aware, but you said you don’t get sick, so what’s the problem.

This virus isn’t going away for a long time. If the vaccine doesn’t stop anybody from getting it, then even if everybody is vaccinated, it is still going to propagate through society.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

"If you're arguing with an idiot, make sure he isn't doing the same thing."
The Dad Fisherman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2021, 04:20 PM   #94
spence
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
spence's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman View Post
Well aware, but you said you don’t get sick, so what’s the problem.

This virus isn’t going away for a long time. If the vaccine doesn’t stop anybody from getting it, then even if everybody is vaccinated, it is still going to propagate through society.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Not necessarily. The more virus in the population increases the chances for more deadly mutations.
spence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2021, 04:36 PM   #95
The Dad Fisherman
Super Moderator
iTrader: (0)
 
The Dad Fisherman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Georgetown MA
Posts: 18,189
Quote:
Originally Posted by spence View Post
Not necessarily. The more virus in the population increases the chances for more deadly mutations.
Didn’t we just establish that the vaccine doesn’t stop you from getting the virus? So it shouldn’t be shrinking that footprint.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

"If you're arguing with an idiot, make sure he isn't doing the same thing."
The Dad Fisherman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2021, 04:39 PM   #96
spence
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
spence's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman View Post
Didn’t we just establish that the vaccine doesn’t stop you from getting the virus? So it shouldn’t be shrinking that footprint.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
The vaccine has shown to reduce the amount of virus in the population even if it's not 100%.
spence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2021, 05:28 PM   #97
PaulS
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
PaulS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 10,242
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dad Fisherman View Post
Well aware, but you said you don’t get sick, so what’s the problem.

This virus isn’t going away for a long time. If the vaccine doesn’t stop anybody from getting it, then even if everybody is vaccinated, it is still going to propagate through society.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
I don't think I ever said that I or someone else won't get sick. If you are vaccinated and get sick you're less likely to get seriously feel from it. We're lucky with the Delta variant that if you're vaccinated you're less likely to be seriously ill. We don't know what will happen with the next variant.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
PaulS is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2021, 05:55 AM   #98
scottw
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
scottw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulS View Post
I don't think I ever said that I or someone else won't get sick. If you are vaccinated and get sick you're less likely to get seriously feel from it. We're lucky with the Delta variant that if you're vaccinated you're less likely to be seriously ill. We don't know what will happen with the next variant.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
I read that there will be a variant soon that will be resistant to the vaccine...who will you get mad at then?
scottw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2021, 06:01 AM   #99
scottw
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
scottw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
Quote:
Originally Posted by spence View Post
The vaccine has shown to reduce the amount of virus in the population even if it's not 100%.
the most vaccinated place on earth...
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_8229.PNG
Views:	139
Size:	121.4 KB
ID:	68311   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_8228.PNG
Views:	143
Size:	88.8 KB
ID:	68312  
scottw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-30-2021, 06:04 PM   #100
Got Stripers
Ledge Runner Baits
iTrader: (0)
 
Got Stripers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: I live in a house, but my soul is at sea.
Posts: 8,456
FL and it’s governor are calling you, it’s where you can be free from government overreach and die under your own terms.
Got Stripers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-30-2021, 08:18 PM   #101
Pete F.
Canceled
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,075
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottw View Post
the most vaccinated place on earth...
Meanwhile in Israel, healthcare providers are continuing their rapid rollout of vaccine booster shots, after the third doses were approved for the entire population over 12. As of Sunday evening, 2,102,426 Israelis — close to 23% of the population — had received a third shot.
Guess they’re doing it for fun
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!

Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?

Lets Go Darwin
Pete F. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2021, 04:53 AM   #102
scottw
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
scottw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
Quote:
Originally Posted by Got Stripers View Post
FL and it’s governor are calling you, it’s where you can be free from government overreach and die under your own terms.
planning to head down in November 99.7926% of Florida residents have not died from covid if my math is correct....I'm healthy, vaccinated and I wear a N95 mask in places where it seems appropriate, I just believe that people are responsible to make their own decisions regarding some of these things and that there is a lot of overreach... which makes me an "anti-vaxxer" by the latest revision of definitions to suit some people....
scottw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2021, 04:54 AM   #103
scottw
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
scottw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F. View Post
Meanwhile in Israel, healthcare providers are continuing their rapid rollout of vaccine booster shots, after the third doses were approved for the entire population over 12. As of Sunday evening, 2,102,426 Israelis — close to 23% of the population — had received a third shot.
Guess they’re doing it for fun
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
most vaccinated state in the country...be safe up there
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_8253.jpg
Views:	135
Size:	99.3 KB
ID:	68318  
scottw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2021, 07:10 AM   #104
Slipknot
Super Moderator
iTrader: (0)
 
Slipknot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Middleboro MA
Posts: 17,123
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete F. View Post
Meanwhile in Israel, healthcare providers are continuing their rapid rollout of vaccine booster shots, after the third doses were approved for the entire population over 12. As of Sunday evening, 2,102,426 Israelis — close to 23% of the population — had received a third shot.
Guess they’re doing it for fun
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
And it is a fact that the unvaccinated with natural immunity there are 13 times less likely to get the variant than the vaccinated.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

The United States Constitution does not exist to grant you rights; those rights are inherent within you. Rather it exists to frame a limited government so that those natural rights can be exercised freely.

1984 was a warning, not a guidebook!

It's time more people spoke up with the truth. Every time we let a leftist lie go uncorrected, the commies get stronger.
Slipknot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2021, 09:54 AM   #105
Got Stripers
Ledge Runner Baits
iTrader: (0)
 
Got Stripers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: I live in a house, but my soul is at sea.
Posts: 8,456
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slipknot View Post
And it is a fact that the unvaccinated with natural immunity there are 13 times less likely to get the variant than the vaccinated.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
That assumes you survived getting the virus in the first place and hopefully didn’t infect or kill others in the process. The issue is the more this virus has a chance to evolve into the next more deadly variant, the more people die and it is the large unvaccinated population in the world and the US which is allowing it to happen. This latest variant has proven to be an issue for the young who may not have had issues with the initial virus, which again highlights the need to get more vaccinated.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Got Stripers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2021, 12:31 PM   #106
Pete F.
Canceled
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,075
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slipknot View Post
And it is a fact that the unvaccinated with natural immunity there are 13 times less likely to get the variant than the vaccinated.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
The group of unvaccinated persons are truly survivors of their first infection, this means that many of the weak and problematic health cases have died during their first infection and are no longer present in that group. If Covid has a mortality of 1.5%, then this subgroup is 240 cases for the 16000 large group. However: all those cases of weak and problematic health who likely die from an unprotected infection are still present in the group of SARS-CoV-2-naïve vaccinees. So a selection was done where the most vulnerable persons were taken out of the unvaccinated group (death), but that selection is not done in the vaccinated group simply because it is not possible to predict at forehand who will die from an unprotected Covid infection. Although the groups are finally selected on equal risk factors, the above observation will always introduce a huge statistical bias.

I am quite sure that the group of cases found in the 'vaccine' group are largely those persons who would have died from an unprotected Covid infection. Because those persons are by definition not present in the unvaccinated group (they died during the first infection) you can explain the number of cases in both groups precisely by the above described mechanism. The conclusion then is that the found cases have nothing to do with 'better resistance due to an earlier infection'.

Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!

Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?

Lets Go Darwin
Pete F. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2021, 12:34 PM   #107
spence
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
spence's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottw View Post
the most vaccinated place on earth...
I think they wrote this for you.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlo...psons-paradox/
spence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2021, 12:40 PM   #108
scottw
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
scottw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
Quote:
Originally Posted by Got Stripers View Post

That assumes you survived getting the virus

Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
odds are pretty good...according to Johns Hopkins University’s mortality data as of Aug 6... 98.3% of people in the US who have gotten covid survived, we know that there were a lot of "covid deaths" from car accidents and stuff and that there are probably lots of unreported covid cases that would bring that number even higher...you sound as though 98.3% have died after getting it...very odd
scottw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2021, 12:49 PM   #109
scottw
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
scottw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
Quote:
Originally Posted by spence View Post
are you suggesting I don't think the vaccines work? I'm not paying wapo to read their article...I got vaccinated.... and not because I think they don't work...
scottw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2021, 01:02 PM   #110
Got Stripers
Ledge Runner Baits
iTrader: (0)
 
Got Stripers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: I live in a house, but my soul is at sea.
Posts: 8,456
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottw View Post
odds are pretty good...according to Johns Hopkins University’s mortality data as of Aug 6... 98.3% of people in the US who have gotten covid survived, we know that there were a lot of "covid deaths" from car accidents and stuff and that there are probably lots of unreported covid cases that would bring that number even higher...you sound as though 98.3% have died after getting it...very odd
Boy how you can twist a post into something I didn’t say, doesn’t survive mean the group Bruce refers to lived, dahhh. Getting it and surviving doesn’t make you immune to the next variation and studies now show long term effects from getting covid are common, personally I’d rather be vaccinated once, twice and a third time rather than rolling the dice, which is exactly what you do if you don’t get vaccinated.
Got Stripers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2021, 06:44 PM   #111
spence
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
spence's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: RI
Posts: 21,231
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottw View Post
are you suggesting I don't think the vaccines work? I'm not paying wapo to read their article...I got vaccinated.... and not because I think they don't work...
Keep up please.
spence is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2021, 06:15 AM   #112
Got Stripers
Ledge Runner Baits
iTrader: (0)
 
Got Stripers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: I live in a house, but my soul is at sea.
Posts: 8,456
Boy the don’t mess with my freedoms crowd are not going to like the latest mandates, although it should help the majority of our workforce. Doing so should help the economy if the majority of the US workers get vaccinated. I get the argument, but we have lost numbers that basically make this a world war, why not join forces to beat the enemy and prevent that next variant that could be far worse?
Got Stripers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2021, 07:18 AM   #113
JohnR
Certifiable Intertidal Anguiologist
iTrader: (1)
 
JohnR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Somewhere between OOB & west of Watch Hill
Posts: 35,134
Blog Entries: 1
TL : DR

The problems with vaccines are that racist white people on the right side of the aisle won't do their part.

It is not black people, hispanic people, asian people, or native American people that have low vaccination rates (they do - fortunately it is improving).

It is not Illinois, Colorado, Oregon, Virginia, each roughly on par with Florida, with vaccination rates - it is Florida that is the problem.

It is the Freedom loving white people that are the problem.

This has been insanely over f cking politicized.

~Fix the Bait~ ~Pogies Forever~

Striped Bass Fishing - All Stripers


Kobayashi Maru Election - there is no way to win.


Apocalypse is Coming:
JohnR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2021, 07:19 AM   #114
JohnR
Certifiable Intertidal Anguiologist
iTrader: (1)
 
JohnR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Somewhere between OOB & west of Watch Hill
Posts: 35,134
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slipknot View Post
And it is a fact that the unvaccinated with natural immunity there are 13 times less likely to get the variant than the vaccinated.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

I don't think this is true, Bruce.

~Fix the Bait~ ~Pogies Forever~

Striped Bass Fishing - All Stripers


Kobayashi Maru Election - there is no way to win.


Apocalypse is Coming:
JohnR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2021, 07:46 PM   #115
Slipknot
Super Moderator
iTrader: (0)
 
Slipknot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Middleboro MA
Posts: 17,123
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnR View Post
I don't think this is true, Bruce.
It is from a study
The total context may be incomplete but that is the results that were publicized.


A new study from Israel looked at thousands of people who had either been vaccinated against COVID-19 or were unvaccinated but previously infected
Participants who were double jabbed were 5.96 times more likely to be infected and 7.13 times more likely to experience symptoms
After three months, risk of infection was 13.06 times higher among immunized individuals and they were 27 times more likely to experience symptoms
Researchers say the study has many limitations including the Indian 'Delta' variant being dominant and participants not being required to be tested
The study does not discourage vaccination because unvaccinated people are still more likely to be infected with Covid or hospitalized than vaccinated people
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

The United States Constitution does not exist to grant you rights; those rights are inherent within you. Rather it exists to frame a limited government so that those natural rights can be exercised freely.

1984 was a warning, not a guidebook!

It's time more people spoke up with the truth. Every time we let a leftist lie go uncorrected, the commies get stronger.
Slipknot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-11-2021, 06:00 AM   #116
Nebe
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
Nebe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Libtardia
Posts: 21,591
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slipknot View Post
It is from a study
The total context may be incomplete but that is the results that were publicized.


A new study from Israel looked at thousands of people who had either been vaccinated against COVID-19 or were unvaccinated but previously infected
Participants who were double jabbed were 5.96 times more likely to be infected and 7.13 times more likely to experience symptoms
After three months, risk of infection was 13.06 times higher among immunized individuals and they were 27 times more likely to experience symptoms
Researchers say the study has many limitations including the Indian 'Delta' variant being dominant and participants not being required to be tested
The study does not discourage vaccination because unvaccinated people are still more likely to be infected with Covid or hospitalized than vaccinated people
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Have you been sniffing the Tightbond again ?? “A study”. What study? To think that these vaccines don’t work is ridiculous.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Nebe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-11-2021, 07:29 AM   #117
JohnR
Certifiable Intertidal Anguiologist
iTrader: (1)
 
JohnR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Somewhere between OOB & west of Watch Hill
Posts: 35,134
Blog Entries: 1
I read an interesting dive into the various studies. Several hypotheses can be drawn:


Previous Covid infection is one of the best defenses against getting C19 again, or the Delta.


Getting vaccinated on top of a previous infection is even more safe.

Pfizer seems to have most lost of effectiveness


https://maximumtruth.substack.com/p/...source=twitter

~Fix the Bait~ ~Pogies Forever~

Striped Bass Fishing - All Stripers


Kobayashi Maru Election - there is no way to win.


Apocalypse is Coming:
JohnR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-11-2021, 10:47 AM   #118
Got Stripers
Ledge Runner Baits
iTrader: (0)
 
Got Stripers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: I live in a house, but my soul is at sea.
Posts: 8,456
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnR View Post
I read an interesting dive into the various studies. Several hypotheses can be drawn:


Previous Covid infection is one of the best defenses against getting C19 again, or the Delta.


Getting vaccinated on top of a previous infection is even more safe.

Pfizer seems to have most lost of effectiveness


https://maximumtruth.substack.com/p/...source=twitter
We will all no doubt know more going forward, but I’d agree with the conclusion at the end, getting the vaccine regardless of your vaccine status is good for society and probably especially valuable to anyone living a more risky public life.
Got Stripers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-11-2021, 11:32 AM   #119
Pete F.
Canceled
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: vt
Posts: 13,075
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnR View Post
I read an interesting dive into the various studies. Several hypotheses can be drawn:


Previous Covid infection is one of the best defenses against getting C19 again, or the Delta.


Getting vaccinated on top of a previous infection is even more safe.

Pfizer seems to have most lost of effectiveness


https://maximumtruth.substack.com/p/...source=twitter
What I don’t see in the comparison of the difference in effectiveness between having previously had COVID and the vaccine is the fact that if you had Covid previously you survived.
Taking the most vulnerable out of the data would skew the results.
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device
Posted from my iPhone/Mobile device

Frasier: Niles, I’ve just had the most marvelous idea for a website! People will post their opinions, cheeky bon mots, and insights, and others will reply in kind!

Niles: You have met “people”, haven’t you?

Lets Go Darwin
Pete F. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-11-2021, 12:44 PM   #120
scottw
Registered User
iTrader: (0)
 
scottw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 12,632
just curious..."IF" they discover a way to inject something with the vaccine into you or implant something under your skin that will let the government know that you have Covid or whatever so that they can make sure that you are not a threat to others...would you jump right in line? Would you support mandates for this science?...it would be "good for society and probably especially valuable to anyone living a more risky public life"..think about the possibilities


https://news.yahoo.com/pentagon-unve...231239955.html
scottw is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:59 PM.


Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Please use all necessary and proper safety precautions. STAY SAFE Striper Talk Forums
Copyright 1998-20012 Striped-Bass.com