girl solo sailor epibs went off this AM

[likwid]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Here's what you can't understand. If this kid had died, I would feel awful about that, and I'd feel angry at the waste. I've seen too many teenagers die for noble causes, to comprehend why parents would allow such risks for something as meaningless as 15 minutes of fame (and she had a blog and website, so don't tell me that's not what motivated her in some fashion, which, by the way, is understandable for a kid).

In some way, all of us, even you, have a vested interest in the safety and quality of life of future generations.

And don't give me that "who are you to judge" crap, that's the last-ditch effort of someone who would never admit that someone else might have a point.

People lose their lives doing all kinds of things, hell even crossing the street, nevermind sitting infront of the TV getting fat and never doing anything with their life and having their heart go on revolt.

You DON'T have a point because you cannot put yourself into her shoes or anyone elses. You live in a little world that things need to be "safe" and "secure" where things are served to you in appropriate portions and nothing bad ever happens.

Thats not living.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by likwid

People lose their lives doing all kinds of things, hell even crossing the street, nevermind sitting infront of the TV getting fat and never doing anything with their life and having their heart go on revolt.

You DON'T have a point because you cannot put yourself into her shoes or anyone elses. You live in a little world that things need to be "safe" and "secure" where things are served to you in appropriate portions and nothing bad ever happens.

Thats not living.

Can you read likwid?

"People lose their lives doing all kinds of things, hell even crossing the street"

People have to cross the street. No one has to do something as dangerous as sailing solo around the world, much less a teenager. Your arguments just don't make sense.

"nevermind sitting infront of the TV getting fat and never doing anything with their life and having their heart go on revolt."

Oh, I see. So anyone who doesn't sail around the world solo at 16, is a sedentary couch potato with no reason to live.

I don't have to know her personally to care about her and wish her well. Nor do I have to know her personally to know when her parents are needlessly endangering her.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by likwid

People lose their lives doing all kinds of things, hell even crossing the street, nevermind sitting infront of the TV getting fat and never doing anything with their life and having their heart go on revolt.

You DON'T have a point because you cannot put yourself into her shoes or anyone elses. You live in a little world that things need to be "safe" and "secure" where things are served to you in appropriate portions and nothing bad ever happens.

Thats not living.

My last post on this thread...

"You live in a little world that things need to be "safe" and "secure" where things are served to you in appropriate portions and nothing bad ever happens. "

Let's see, I did 2 combat tours in Iraq with the USMC as the CO of a weapons company. I've been in for-real combat, and I lost 2 kids under my command. I bet I know ALMOST AS WELL AS YOU, that bad things do happen.

In fact, it's precisely because I know that bad things happen, that I see no reason to go begging for trouble. Children's lives are about the most precious thing I can imagine, I don't see the value in risking it for a bit of notoriety.

I also don't like it when someone insults me right off the bat, then has the hutzpah to tell me I have no right to judge others, just because you know you don't have the logical ability to defend your position.

[likwid]

Don't worry, I called my parents and let them know they should be in jail for child abuse due to letting me and my sister do alot of things that most people would consider "abusive and dumb".

Fishing Woods Hole when I was 15 in a RIB by myself after dark for one.

(Note: I did have a handheld vhf, knew how to use it, and how to call properly, unlike most d**kwagons on the water these days three times the age)

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by likwid

Don't worry, I called my parents and let them know they should be in jail for child abuse due to letting me and my sister do alot of things that most people would consider "abusive and dumb".

Fishing Woods Hole when I was 15 in a RIB by myself after dark for one.

(Note: I did have a handheld vhf, knew how to use it, and how to call properly, unlike most d**kwagons on the water these days three times the age)

Sorry, I can't resist.

You criticize me for not knowing what it takes to sail across the world solo (and I admitted I had no such knowledge). And then you (the self-proclaimed maritime expert) compare THAT RISK to fishing in Woods Hole at night in a RIB? That's comparable to sailing around the southern tip of Africa in the winter? Really?

[likwid]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Sorry, I can't resist.

You criticize me for not knowing what it takes to sail across the world solo (and I admitted I had no such knowledge). And then you (the self-proclaimed maritime expert) compare THAT RISK to fishing in Woods Hole at night in a RIB? That's comparable to sailing around the southern tip of Africa in the winter? Really?

Aren't we discussing parental responsibility? Thats what YOU said we were discussing, not offshore ability.

[numbskull]

Originally Posted by Jim in CT

Let's see, I did 2 combat tours in Iraq with the USMC as the CO of a weapons company. I've been in for-real combat, and I lost 2 kids under my command.
.

Give it up. Likwid's mother is a hotshot sailor and likwid himself fished WH in the dark! Why would you think he could learn anything about responsibility for other's lives from someone as inexperienced as you?

[likwid]

Apparently along side this girl's attempt (and MIGHT or MIGHT NOT have had ANYTHING to do with HER decision to make the attempt) was the father trying to make a buck off this.

Thats directly from the SoCal sailing scene, please be sure to note the stuff in parentheses. I know, its difficult to not just revert to thinking this is politics, but read it all with a grain of salt please.

But most non-coddled 16yo's would tell a parent to go f*** themselves if they weren't prepared to do something.

[numbskull]

Originally Posted by likwid

But most non-coddled 16yo's would tell a parent to go f*** themselves if they weren't prepared to do something.

In which case a responsible parent would take away their $500,000 sailboat for a month.

[Jim in CT]

Originally Posted by numbskull

Give it up. Likwid's mother is a hotshot sailor and likwid himself fished WH in the dark! Why would you think he could learn anything about responsibility for other's lives from someone as inexperienced as you?

LMAO numbskull, hope I can buy you a beer one day...

[Nebe]

her new boat has been chosen.

[MAC]

I've sat back watching this thread from the start. I can appreciate both sides of the arguement. I do lean more towards Numby and Jims side though.

My question; Are her parents going to pay for a rescue if needed on another attempt ? Through her families own admission rescue crews were dispatched from 3 continents..... Wonder what the combined cost was ? 10 million ?

[likwid]

Originally Posted by MAC

I've sat back watching this thread from the start. I can appreciate both sides of the arguement. I do lean more towards Numby and Jims side though.

My question; Are her parents going to pay for a rescue if needed on another attempt ? Through her families own admission rescue crews were dispatched from 3 continents..... Wonder what the combined cost was ? 10 million ?

Couple hundred grand covered by insurance.

[nightfighter]

Originally Posted by likwid

Couple hundred grand covered by insurance.

Maybe so, but the response just sounds so cavalier.....I mean, just when have you gotten an Airbus fueled up and told them "don't worry, I have insurance...." Insurance companies are exactly known as the fastest paying outfits around. It's not like they have a regulated "settlement" timeframe like the securities industry does for their transactions. And let's not forget the men and or women who went out there or altered course and missions to assist.


(Damn.... I was doing so well at not getting baited back into this thread, too.....)

[MarshCappa]

Alright, I think this event has brought out some interesting debate and may have gotten a little to personal but I think we're all big boys here and can take it. We have 2 camps here with valid points made on both sides.

This is a sailing family we're talking about here that feels they made the right decisions for a kid that obviously is talented and mature beyond her actual age. I support their judgement and in some ways I am envious that they have kids that have drive, intelligence, and the guts to do something with their lives instead of sitting on the sidelines and watching the world go by on the tv or computer.

The other camp seems to be made up of people that don't come from a sailing background or believe that the parents made a mistake and that Abby herself isn't capable or wasn't prepared for this journey. I'm not saying their wrong but it comes from a different angle.

I think we all need to agree to disagree but respect eachothers views without personally attacking someones opinions. There are some interesting perspectives here(on this thread) from people that have real experience on both sides of this issue.

I'm done debating this but man it is a very interesting story and I can't help but become inspired by this girls drive and maturity. I think other kids should take a look at what she and her brother have accomplished and take it as a lesson and dare i say role model of what you can do in life when you put your mind to it. Hard work, dedication, appreciation of our planet, mother nature, and it's inhabitants and how it all is connected are the messages that kids need these days. Too many kids today are lazy, unmotiviated, and unappreciative of what makes this world go round and this girl represents the exact opposite of what our society is turning into.

I'm out but will keep reading the responses. Thanks for the interesting views. Now i think it's time for a

[likwid]

As someone else put it, I suppose she made it from California around Cape Horn and the Cape of Good Hope on blind f***ing luck?

[Typhoon]

You could have put the best Volvo ocean race sailors in the boat and the outcome would have been the same.

They said 50-60 ft seas. I watched the documentary on PBS about the last Volvo ocean race and only a handful were able to complete the race with multi-multi-multi million dollar backing. They were in every port doing structural repairs for each leg. The odds are stacked way against you.

I'm in the camp of letting my children find their limits. I did it. I was foolish and lucky more times than I can count. I want to help my children find their limits in a safer method than I did.

Whether it be a youth go kart racing league instead of street racing at 1am, or joining an extreme ski school instead of the nonsense back country chances I took.

Kids will make dangerous choices no matter how hard you try and stop them. It's our job as parents to mitigate the danger. My choice will be through education not prohibition.